Weapon Master - skills or weapons?

[GWJ]

Does Weapon Master (version for 20 pts, one weapon) affects every weapon usable with one particular skill? Or one specific weapon, usable in any way? For example Weapon Master for thrusting bastard sword. In 20 pts version, this advantage gives me bonuses for use this sword (both in 1 hand with skill broadsword, and in 2 hands with skill two-handed sword), or bonuses for use every sword with broadsword skill and not two-handed swords (or vice versa)?

[Celjabba]

I think (not absolutely sure) that it is the player/GM choice :
Weapon master (broadsword) will cover any weapon wielded with the Broadsword skill. (mostly all one handed, edged, swinging, balanced blade)
Weapon master (katana) would cover skill:broadsword and skill: two-handed sword when wielding a katana.

Hope this help,

Celjabba

[simply Nathan]

The interpretation I generally see on the forum holds that it is supposed to be for specific weapons; Weapon Master(Broadsword) covers only the broadsword, not katanas, cavalry sabers, edged rapiers, or thrusting broadswords in that case.

While Weapon Master(Katana) doesn't cover cavalry sabers, naginatas, late-era katanas, and the like but it does cover the normal katana listed as such whether used with one hand or two.



This interpretation is mainstream and part of the FAQ as far as I know, but it doesn't match up with the one character write-up I've seen on the books with Weapon Master on the character sheet. She has Weapon Master(Bow), but there is no weapon just called "bow" in the basic set's weapon table, and as an ST 9 elf she doesn't have enough ST to draw an ST 10 regular bow or an ST 11 longbow so her mastery must by elimination apply to a shortbow.

But she wasn't written up with Weapon Master(Shortbow) or with a larger category like Weapon Master(All bows).

[roguebfl]

Here is what Kromm has said on the topic:

Originally Posted by Kromm

To be honest, I'd dispense with all the modifiers and simply allow a 15-point version of Weapon Master. It fits the listed progression:

All Weapons [45] > All bladed weapons [40] > All swords [35] > All samurai swords (katana, nodachi, tanto, wakizashi) [30] > Daisho (katana & wakizashi) [25] > Katana* [20] > My katana [15]

Given that the potential benefits include halved penalties for Rapid Strike and multiple parries (an effective +3 or +4 skill for these purposes) and +2 damage per die, I would not go lower. Not if I wanted a balanced starting PC.

--

* By the way, we do mean a specific weapon and not a weapon skill. If you're a master with the katana, the benefits of WM apply whether you use it with one hand (Broadsword) or two (Two-Handed Sword) . . . and even if you somehow contrive to throw it. But they don't apply to any other use of Broadsword, Two-Handed Sword, or this putative Thrown Weapon (Sword) skill.

[DangerousThing]

Originally Posted by roguebfl

Here is what Kromm has said on the topic:

In my current game (a somewhat steam-punkish space opera at TL 6+2) the Rangers (part of the Confederation's military) train their officers in the Clockwork Staff.

Folded, it is a baton. When extended it is a staff. When the blade is extended it's a naginata. And yet this is considered and treated as a single weapon. There's also an intermediate stage where it looks like a machete with a long handle.

How would Weapon Master treat a weapon like this?

[Kazander]

Presumably, like anything else. WM (Clockwork Staff) gives you the bonuses when using the CS, and only the CS, not other batons, staves, machetes or naginata.

It does take 3 different skills to use: Short Sword, Staff and Polearm. At least there is a default between Polearm and Staff. And I'm sure it takes an Exotic Weapon Training perk to use.

[DangerousThing]

Originally Posted by Kazander

Presumably, like anything else. WM (Clockwork Staff) gives you the bonuses when using the CS, and only the CS, not other batons, staves, machetes or naginata.

It does take 3 different skills to use: Short Sword, Staff and Polearm. At least there is a default between Polearm and Staff. And I'm sure it takes an Exotic Weapon Training perk to use.

It's not exotic in my setting, though it is easily identifiable as Confederation Ranger equipment. The fancy ones that are carried by two characters who are entitled to carry them are the equivalent of a medal.

Basically they just scream "ex-special forces here!" And I doubt they are the most dangerous members of the party. Though we haven't had any more than nuisance combats yet, so I'll have to wait before I can really tell. Each party member has their own niche, though there is a lot of overlap in places.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Kenneth Latrans

The interpretation I generally see on the forum holds that it is supposed to be for specific weapons; Weapon Master(Broadsword) covers only the broadsword, not katanas, cavalry sabers, edged rapiers, or thrusting broadswords in that case.

.

It's not quite that bad. From discussions with Kromm there's a "common sense" clause in the "one weapon" rule. So even though Broadsword and Thrusting Broadsword are technically 2 entries on the weapons table they are covered by the same 20pt WM.

Wooden practice swords like Bokken are also covered by Katana but this does need to be interpreted narrowly as "blunt wooden weapon deliberately mimicking edged steel'. It's not all light clubs, just shortswords and dusacks and so on..

Other very similar weapons were things like Rapiers and Edged Rapiers.

If anyone wonders this is a 4e rule. If you go back to 3e and look at the rules text WM worked by Skill in that edition. I don't know if it was fairer or more realistic but it was simpler.

[kirbwarrior]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

It's not quite that bad. From discussions with Kromm there's a "common sense" clause in the "one weapon" rule. So even though Broadsword and Thrusting Broadsword are technically 2 entries on the weapons table they are covered by the same 20pt WM.

Wooden practice swords like Bokken are also covered by Katana but this does need to be interpreted narrowly as "blunt wooden weapon deliberately mimicking edged steel'. It's not all light clubs, just shortswords and dusacks and so on..

Other very similar weapons were things like Rapiers and Edged Rapiers.

If anyone wonders this is a 4e rule. If you go back to 3e and look at the rules text WM worked by Skill in that edition. I don't know if it was fairer or more realistic but it was simpler.

It does create a strange occurrence when used with Imbuements, since WM chooses a weapon and Imbuements picks a weapon skill. I've heard that it's fair to pick a weapon instead, but then it's still weird if you want lots of imbuements for just one weapon.

WM (THS) is probably fine at [30], considering how wide the category is. That is probably true for any weapon skill.

[simply Nathan]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

It's not quite that bad. From discussions with Kromm there's a "common sense" clause in the "one weapon" rule. So even though Broadsword and Thrusting Broadsword are technically 2 entries on the weapons table they are covered by the same 20pt WM.

Well I've never seen it mentioned as such on the forums before.

In any case, GURPS is a lot more lenient on this than say AD&D 2e where every single weapon is a separate proficiency of its own even if they're used identically or one is made for training to use the other (bokken and katana; wooden training sword, longsword, and broadsword; dirk, dagger, stiletto, shiv, and knife; flail and nunchucks...).