02-25-2021, 12:20 PM | #11 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
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What I said would happen if someone tried the "knife to the throst" trick in front of Nyx is what would really happen in that world and i am not going to cheat in the name of "Story". Does this mean that some (IMHO badly overused and unrealistic) tropes from Fiction don't work in RPGs? This is indeed my experience and an experienced game master will have learned not to invoke the god from the machine to make them happen.
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Fred Brackin |
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02-25-2021, 12:52 PM | #12 | |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
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As for the reality of it, I don't think that stands where you're putting it. It's not actually that easy to guarantee someone dies, especially that they die quickly. (And if you're really trying to, you should be going for a Telegraphic All Out Attack to a super-high value hit location, either Double or Strong, and add in Rapid Strike too if you've got the skill to spare. Of course, that may guarantee your instant decapitation by angry minotaur.) With proper use of the bleeding rules it is fairly easy to wound an unprotected person of typical resilience so that they will very likely die if not provided serious medical care. So if the PCs don't have the kind of healing magic that laughs at such things, you could wind up with medical drama after your hostage drama.
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I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. |
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02-25-2021, 12:59 PM | #13 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
thank you for those with helpful advice and points of view.
I got what I needed. I was more curious on how others handled this issue. Thankfully GURPS has built in things that D&D does not, making that video's overall message moot when it comes to comparing them both, and HPs may just be a the best option. Some games use the concept of Health Levels like WoD, but Hps may be the best way overall. Have a good day all. Last edited by Lameth; 02-25-2021 at 01:03 PM. |
02-25-2021, 01:14 PM | #14 | |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
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EDIT:"Conditional Injury" (Pyramid #3/120), indeed written by Douglas Cole. Note this largely serves to improve survivability, by preventing multiple injuries from "stacking" quite as readily (a single 10 HP wound is more severe than two 5 HP wounds).
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GURPS Overhaul Last edited by Varyon; 02-25-2021 at 01:21 PM. |
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02-25-2021, 01:35 PM | #15 | ||
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
[QUOTE=Varyon;2368973]Slitting the throat of a helpless enemy can (optionally) get even nastier if using Technical Grappling. [/quoute]
Insert gratuitous plug for Fantastic Dungeon Grappling as the smaller, streamlined alternative. Quote:
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Conditional Injury Impressions and Tweaks Reflections on Conditional Injury Tweaks
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My blog:Gaming Ballistic, LLC My Store: Gaming Ballistic on Shopify My Patreon: Gaming Ballistic on Patreon |
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02-25-2021, 02:06 PM | #16 |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
On one hand, I've never quite liked hit points. Rather than have N blows kill you, I would rather have each blow have a 1/N chance of killing you, so that getting into a fight always has an element of danger.
But on the other hand, as this may suggest, I share Fred's dislike of having whether a character dies be determined by "story." If your character is going into a fight, I don't want you to feel, "I'm playing the hero, so nothing bad will happen to me." I want every fight to have an aspect of risk. What makes you the hero is that, knowing that that risk is there, you've decided that the fight is important enough to justify taking the risk.
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Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
02-25-2021, 02:06 PM | #17 |
Join Date: Aug 2014
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
There are definitely two different styles presented here. One side is the RAW, strategy gamers who use all the numbers and rolls no matter what and play it straight. Then there's the story-tellers who fudge rolls or rule by fiat. Both are perfectly valid ways to play, it just depends on the GM and their players. Personally, I like both, it just depends on the game.
The important thing is to make sure the players understand which type of scenario they're in. Obviously, if they are thinking in terms of the former, doing the math, checking character and item stats, etc. then they're going to reach different conclusions. If they calculate that the hostage can probably take the hit and they can run over and heal them, they may just bite the bullet and attack. If the GM then said, "Nope, throat slit, they're dead", the players would definitely feel cheated and it would not be fun. If instead the GM makes clear "You either let the baddie go, or the hostage WILL die", then the players have a very different decision to make. Rather than basing it on the rolls and stats, they'll think in terms of "Do we sacrifice a hostage to take down the bad guy or do we let them go and fight another day?" This has a very different feel. These are two very different dynamics but neither is better than the other. Again, the most important thing is making sure the players know how the game will go. The GM should also keep the feel of the game consistent. If it's 90% hack and slash, stats, and gaming it out then all of a sudden none of that matters and it's purely a story-based decision, it feels very jarring and unfair. That's all a very long-winded way of not actually answering the question and just saying it depends. Make the decision based on yourself, your players, and your game.
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"Even a toddler with a .22 pistol could accidentally roll a critical hit." -tshiggins |
02-25-2021, 02:25 PM | #18 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
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Last edited by Lameth; 02-25-2021 at 02:50 PM. |
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02-25-2021, 02:33 PM | #19 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
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All in all I mix it together and have had great players that appreciate the story, role playing, plot twists, epic nature, and depth of the game. And as long as they are having fun, screw it. |
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02-25-2021, 02:56 PM | #20 |
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
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Re: Hit Points...to be, or not to be?
This issue is one of the things that drew me to GURPS initially. There were some awkward rules in D&D for this sort of thing, but it always felt very much like DM fiat. In GURPS, my group rarely used the hit location rules in our first campaigns, but we liked it that a crossbow bolt was always dangerous unless you had magical protection or other pricey "superhero" advantages. A bunch of town guards with crossbows could be a threat. Someone with a knife to your throat might not instantly kill you, but it could be really bad. I've rarely seen GURPS PCs act as invulnerable as their D&D counterparts unless they are seriously buffed and prepared.
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