01-20-2014, 01:22 AM | #21 |
Join Date: Mar 2013
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
You to missed the point, if they define it in terms of a unit that is rate of change, it's the change that would matter, not the actual amount of energy or power that can be delivered through what ever outlet (Such as a power point)
And things like watt/seconds are around, here, from the wikipedia article on killowatt hour: "Watts per hour (W/h) is a unit of a change of power per hour." Also I think theres and error on the Technomancer table, in the foot notes it defines a 12 V cell as a car battery (Fair enough, try finding another source/use of 12 V cells), but then it goes on the say that you should halve power available from rechargeable sources Now would anyone be upset if I took this topic further afield? |
01-20-2014, 08:05 AM | #22 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Quote:
Steal Power needs a form that's stored. It's the one that would need kilowatt-seconds. Or kilojoules but not kilowatts.
__________________
Fred Brackin |
|
01-20-2014, 09:02 AM | #23 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Quote:
I can't see that it helps sort out this discussion if you use muddled terminology. Incidentally, GURPS Thaumatology: Urban Magics explains the whole business on pp. 26-27, if you want a fourth edition source. It also provides Minor Draw Power, which can convert 6 kW into 1 FP/minute (at a maintenance cost of 1 FP/minute, so you need 12 kW to have a net gain—still more than most low-tech societies can provide, but a TL(4+1)^ society might have suitable power sources). Bill Stoddard |
|
01-20-2014, 11:10 AM | #24 | |
Join Date: Aug 2007
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Quote:
I know Minor Draw Power doesn't follow this rule but it's an entirely different spell. I also know it exists partly because you can't do anything with low tech sources of power without it. Having double-checked Gurps Magic the term it uses is "power" for Draw Power and "stored power" for Steal Power. You might think it should be using "energy" for that use. The book does speak of "energy" once but when it does so it's referring to the mage's FP. At least that use doesn't conform to your electrical engineering definitions. I am not at all sure that Gurps Magic was written to use your technically correct engineering terminology. I suspect that it might be written in Common English, a notably imprecise language. Nevertheless I do understand how the spells work and your diversions about terminology have not changed how they work..
__________________
Fred Brackin |
|
01-20-2014, 11:49 AM | #25 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Quote:
I don't doubt that you actually do understand the physics. But I'm a professional copy editor; I have spent much of my working life reading passages that fail to express concepts accurately—ranging from those where the problem is simple linguistic carelessness to those where the writer has not thought through the actual ideas and is confused about what they are trying to say. I've seen how such text can produce misunderstanding in readers, and indeed one of my most important professional skills is a practiced ability to think of ways in which a sentence could be misunderstood. You may know what you're talking about, but there have been other posts in this thread by people who aren't clear on the physics, or who actually understand it incorrectly. That's not going to lead to useful discussion, not in dealing with a system of rules that do in fact reflect the real world physics and engineering. Bill Stoddard |
|
01-20-2014, 11:50 AM | #26 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
There actually are primary (i.e. not intended to be recharged) lead acid batteries out there. Mostly in rarely used backup gear where you keep the acid separate from the plates until you want to use the battery too.
__________________
-- MA Lloyd |
01-20-2014, 12:00 PM | #27 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Which is also the reason the entire concept of using real world energy for powering spells is flawed, at least with any sort of linear relationship. The difference in magnitudes inevitably means that if you have a conversion that is balanced for non-portable industrial sources it's going to be utterly useless for batteries or household sources. For that matter if you have one balanced for volcanos, forest fires or storms, it'll be useless for artificial power sources of any sort short of the entire output of TL6+ baseload generating plants.
__________________
-- MA Lloyd |
01-20-2014, 12:58 PM | #28 |
Join Date: Mar 2013
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
OK, slightly related question: Modern people will recognizes potatoes and other fruits and vegetables as potential electrical sources, and then there's voltaic piles (See High-Tech, page 12, the dirty tech callout)
So how much potatoes do I need for a single point of of FP? |
01-20-2014, 01:02 PM | #29 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Probably infinite, due to internal resistance of the cells.
|
01-20-2014, 01:18 PM | #30 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
|
Re: Thaumaturgic Automata and Draw Power
Quote:
Bill Stoddard |
|
Tags |
fantasy, magic, thaumaturgic automata |
|
|