GURPS, 4th edition D&D, and World Books

[Captain-Captain]

Originally Posted by tbone

Interesting... though I wonder how seriously the industry pros, like the good SJG people, take survey results like that. After all, it's easy for 39% of respondents to say now that they won't switch, but not so easy to continue to resist the pull of a shiny new game... I'll bet a lot of those people do end up switching! (Just a guess, of course.)

I've noticed that the guys who spent the money on the new game are inclined to push it and the people who have said in my presence that they weren't going to get the new edition have knuckled under and bought it. And become prosleytes for it.

The guy who was running a 3.5 game and was supposed to run it this eveening announced he's switching over to 4th and endedhis game tonight. (we wound up playing Munchkin and ended the game with a TPK.) So I'm going to go from a human wizard to something allegedly human with powers. We'll see.

But the 'Roll over and play dead' factor that turned 3.0 to 3.5 appears to be alive and well for 4th despite the polls (the KODT forums had a similar one with very similar results a couple of months back). These guys honestly said they weren't going to switch and then switched.

[Gollum]

Originally Posted by Mgellis

Of course, we're back to the problem of resources. Even if people were willing to write up the new material, it still has to be edited, artwork still has to be done, etc. It's a big risk for SJG.

I'm not a Steve Jackson Games' employee but I'm still sure that if someone write up a good supplement, they will publish it.

The problem is: what is a good supplement? A world, of course, because it is what is lacking in GURPS. But it must have several feature...

• Being completely written... Most GM who create their own world just write notes that only they can understand. A supplement must be comprehensible by anyone, just by reading it. And it's very hard to write a complete 256-page book.
• Being new... Most GURPS GMs play in a already known setting: a movie, a novel or an other role playing game adaptation. A good supplement must be a new setting, not published by another editor.
• Being attractive... That is being original. It's quite easy to create a fantasy world to please your players, for instance. Just put some Elves, Dwarves, Hobbits and a dark threat somewhere... But it's much more hard to create a fantasy world that will attract buyers, that will make them say around: "I want to live my next campaign in this world!"
• Being comprehensive... Being original is not enough. A world also has to be coherent troughout all its pages. And that is a very long job to make a world complete, consistent and coherent.

Brief, it is very hard to create a new world. I think this is the reason why there isn't a good GURPS world yet.

I am trying to design one with one a friend of mine... It will be released... In several years! For the moment, it is just some good ideas written on scratch paper.

[Saint23Molotov]

Originally Posted by Gollum

• Being completely written... Most GM who create their own world just write notes that only they can understand. A supplement must be comprehensible by anyone, just by reading it. And it's very hard to write a complete 256-page book.

• Being new... Most GURPS GMs play in a already known setting: a movie, a novel or an other role playing game adaptation. A good supplement must be a new setting, not published by another editor.

• Being attractive... That is being original. It's quite easy to create a fantasy world to please your players, for instance. Just put some Elves, Dwarves, Hobbits and a dark threat somewhere... But it's much more hard to create a fantasy world that will attract buyers, that will make them say around: "I want to live my next campaign in this world!"

• Being comprehensive... Being original is not enough. A world also has to be coherent troughout all its pages. And that is a very long job to make a world complete, consistent and coherent.

Are you serious? All my settings are fresh from my brain, with only nods or glances to external influences. I mean, I write principally horror-themed settings, but I could probably tone it down for the larger audience and power out a worldbook that fulfills all those criteria. I'm a ragingly prolific worldbuilder, so seriously, if someone waved 20 bucks in front of me, or the prospect of 20 bucks eventually, or even just the chance to work for/with SJG, I could forge a worldbook in a couple weeks I figure. (seriously, ragingly prolific)

[jahn]

You should write for Pyramid first.

[Jürgen Hubert]

Originally Posted by Mgellis

I recently read the follow commentary on 4th edition D&D...

http://jediwiker.livejournal.com/57390.html

...and what shocked me was that 39% of polled players say they will not switch to the new version. (And there's another 22% who appear to be undecided.)

I take this poll as seriously as the polls about disaffected Clinton supporters who say that they will not support Obama in the general elections.

Right now, the emotions are still very high from the change. But give it a few more months, and those numbers will plunge.

[Phantasm]

Originally Posted by Gollum

Brief, it is very hard to create a new world. I think this is the reason why there isn't a good GURPS world yet.

I am trying to design one with one a friend of mine... It will be released... In several years! For the moment, it is just some good ideas written on scratch paper.

I've got a world setting which has hit 135 pages in a Word document, which I've been working on since 2002. At least a third of that is composed of nation descriptions, and there's a good third to half of the document related to playable races and a bestiary. As of right now, it's stalled in several areas because while I've got ideas for a lot of stuff, I don't have them anywhere beyond the "idea" stage. While I'd like to see it published as a full-fledged setting somewhere along the line, it'll probably be another five to ten years at this rate.

Any volunteers to help me out? (Nation descriptions, deity descriptions, and bestiary templates are what I need.)

[Cantankerous]

Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert

I take this poll as seriously as the polls about disaffected Clinton supporters who say that they will not support Obama in the general elections.

Right now, the emotions are still very high from the change. But give it a few more months, and those numbers will plunge.

And maybe not. After having bought the game (the three Core Books) I'm less inclined than ever to do anything with them that doesn't include keeping the papers stacked underneath them from blowing away when the window is open.

Ohh, I think the numbers will come down a bit, maybe a fair bit, but I'd be very surprised if after seeing the mess they made of things that too many hard core RPers will do more than we did, which is try it for a few sessions and then admit it, that we despised, and chuck it back on the shelf.


Isshia

[Cantankerous]

Originally Posted by tbrock1031

I've got a world setting which has hit 135 pages in a Word document, which I've been working on since 2002. At least a third of that is composed of nation descriptions, and there's a good third to half of the document related to playable races and a bestiary. As of right now, it's stalled in several areas because while I've got ideas for a lot of stuff, I don't have them anywhere beyond the "idea" stage. While I'd like to see it published as a full-fledged setting somewhere along the line, it'll probably be another five to ten years at this rate.

Any volunteers to help me out? (Nation descriptions, deity descriptions, and bestiary templates are what I need.)

Really, really really; if this is not a magic heavy setting, I'd love to see what you've got and help as I can.

I'm very experienced at this sort of thing, but lost three very complete and detailed game worlds (two of which we were actively using for six years in one case and three in the other in two separate genres) to a fire a decade ago and have been using Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms (both tweaked to lower the magic count significantly, especially the later) for 3.x D&D and the default Shadowrun setting for that game. I've now finally gotten my Players to try GURPS (I ran it a fair amount back in the day using the Harn setting) and I'm hungry for something they can sink their teeth in to and a writing challenge for myself.

I've got a background in History and creative writing and would love to give a swing at national backgrounds again. E-mail through the link in the profile and I'll certainly be glad to look it over and see what can't be accomplished to help out.


Isshia

[Gollum]

Originally Posted by Saint23Molotov

Are you serious?

Yes I am. How many worlds did J.R.R. Tolkien design? How many word did H. P. Lovecraft design? How many worlds did Georges Lucas Design? Just one... Designing a good world can be a whole life's work.

It's one thing to write notes about a world for some players and friends and another thing to write a complete book, ready to be published, which will fascinate thousands of players...

Originally Posted by Saint23Molotov

All my settings are fresh from my brain, with only nods or glances to external influences. I mean, I write principally horror-themed settings, but I could probably tone it down for the larger audience and power out a worldbook that fulfills all those criteria. I'm a ragingly prolific worldbuilder, so seriously, if someone waved 20 bucks in front of me, or the prospect of 20 bucks eventually, or even just the chance to work for/with SJG, I could forge a worldbook in a couple weeks I figure. (seriously, ragingly prolific)

So, why not typing all your notes on your computer and sending it to Steve Jackson Games? Steve Jackson and and Sean Punch both answer very rapidly an kindly... The worse that you risk is a: "No, sorry, were not interested."

Again, I'm not a SJG employee. But I'm sure that if they have a very interesting (and ready to be published) proposition - rather than perpetual complaints about the lack of settings - they won't let it go to another publisher...

[Turhan's Bey Company]

Originally Posted by Gollum

So, why not typing all your notes on your computer and sending it to Steve Jackson Games?

Alas, according to one of the sub-pages of the writers' guidelines, they don't want new settings at the moment. Not full-length setting treatments, anyway, but smaller locations per the wish list are open for submissions.