Wish List for Car Wars version 4.0

[Execudork]

It's come up in the other Car Wars threads, and a suggestion was made to start a wish list thread. Here it is. Anything you think should be part of the next major revision/release of Car Wars - say it.

Keep in mind that SJGames has already stated that they're not actively working on Car Wars (although that may just be what THEY want you to believe), so don't hold your breath waiting for a hypothetical new release of CW.

[Execudork]

To get the ball rolling....

It's been said several times already - package the rules so that there's a basic version for new players, and an expansion pack full of options for the more experienced. I like this idea, so here's what I'd like to see:

Set 1: Basic Car Wars
One book, not intimidating in its size, containing rules for vehicle movement, combat and basic design. Lots and lots of stock cars in the back, with most or all of the stock cars already written out onto photocopy-able vehicle record sheets.
Simple, straightforward explaination of acceleration, braking, maneouvers and hazards (in that order).
A short list of weapons, with no special ammo modifications or other complexities - MG, RR, Laser, Spike Dropper, Heavy Rocket, MineDropper, Flamethrower, maybe a couple more.
A short list of accessories - just the ones that do one thing in obviously useful ways. No fake anything (vehicle description rules are in the Advanced book), no weird communication or long-distance stuff. Mainly things like Targeting Computer, Fireproofing, Fire Extinguisher (basic version), suspension and chassis upgrades.
Covers Cars, Bikes and Trikes.
This book should come with lots of counters, and a small number of very useful tables on heavier cardstock - Handling chart, Weapon List, Targetting modifiers, Hazards

Set 2: Advanced Rules expansion
First, it should be obvious that this is not a complete game, and needs the basic set to work. Also, this should be cheaper than the basic set since it won't come with many (or perhaps any) maps, and probably few counters
This contains all the accessories for cars, bikes and trikes, as well as the rules for different types of armour (metal etc), a full weapon list with all the funky ammo types and some new rules for tournament play (like vehicle description). The idea is that people buy the basic, play a few times, then get the advanced and play around with more difficult combinations of weapons, ammo and accessories.

Set 3: Other Land Vehicles
Design, maneouver and combat rules for oversized vehicles. A section on campaign and scenario ideas for trucking companies, couriers and the like. Enough counters to make the rules useable. The Truck Stop map.
This should be as small and cheap as possible, since it adds to the game details that only some players will actually want.

Set 4: Boats and Hovercraft
Just like set 3, but for watercraft. Throw in the silly rules for things like dolphins, ducks and fishing contests.

Set 5: Aircraft
Again, just like set 3. Maps for this one are really easy...
Personal pet peeve - print a blimp/airship counter VIEWED FROM ABOVE just like all the other counters! I hate that sideways blimp.

Set 6: Military Vehicles
Again, just like set 3. Put in the rules for spotting and indirect fire.

Campaign Book
Ties Car Wars to GURPS. This could just be GURPS Autoduel, 3rd Edition.

Accessory Sets
Arena Book, Extra Maps (roads, blanks, whatever), extra counter sets. Sprues of plastic guns to glue onto your favourite matchbox cars. Jumping and Falling stuff. Uncle Schmalbert. Whatever.

[Mahdimael]

I've posted in the other forum about this, so see my post there about it.

Some more thoughts-

Dice rolling- I prefer less dice rolls, some prefer more. If I were creating the game, I would try to keep dice rolls to two situations- crashes and fires. I like the old system of damage, but a suggestion I have would be to have everything be rounded to the nearest 10s or 5s. Why? Because it makes the math much quicker and the game moves faster. For example, which is faster?

1. I hit a car with 82 points of armor on the front for 3d6 damage. I roll 17. Subtract.

2. I hit a car with 820 points of armor on the front for 30 damage. Subtract.

Boats, hovercraft, aircraft, tanks, etc- Although I bought both boat wars and tank wars, I was never very keen on any of these vehicles. At the same time, they were new and unique in the way they moved and were designed. I'm not sure what the answer is here- some people love the gimmicky vehicles, others don't. I see them, mainly, as a needless addition- not so much because they are there for the express purpose of being different, but because each vehicle adds a whole layer of complexity to the game- boats don't have wheels, but they do need rudders and waterproof weapons. Tanks need military hardware and treads. If these are released, it should be far along in the game's development cycle, IMHO.

Setting- I enjoyed the post-apocalyptic setting of the first game, I don't disagree that taking it in another direction is a bad idea, even if it's something limited in scope. So perhaps you have the original setting for most of the world, and then there are cities or areas that are completely unaffected- where a lack of threats has made the idle populace turn to autoduelling as a way to amuse themselves. A more varied approach to the world might be interesting to people, and it won't matter to those playing short-term games.

Finally, if the idea for a basic ruleset is adopted, then the most important idea to keep is consistency. The basic ruleset should be the bible, and anything else should be regarded as optional rules. That's why I would be in favor of a larger number of vehicles in the basic book (cars, trikes, motorcycles, buses and rigs)- they give you enough flexibility to create new products, but they all work pretty much the same.

[Saxondog]

Anything released would be nice, but I think people want something more specific on a wish list.

I started playing sometime around Nov, 1981. It replaced a home rules version of a similar game I already played. CarWars was always one of my favorites but there is one thing that ALWAYS bugged me.

A machinegun with the mechanism to aim, space to pivot 45 degrees in any direction and holding 25 bursts of ammo takes up 1 space. A box containing an extra 25 shots also takes up 1 space. Huh??

Re-doing the spaces in a car and the gear in it would top my wish list. Instead of a subcompact having 7 spaces, it might have 15 and a machine gun takes up 2.

Perhaps even do away with the body size definition totally and instead a body costs $x per space, weighs y-lbs per space, etc.

[Jolly Crims]

So do people want:

a.) A reorginized and repackaged version of the old rules with a trimmed down tournament ruleset.

b.) Futher development of the current version.

c.) Something in between.

[KDLadage]

I cannot say this loudly enough:

SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE

The original game (1" = 15') was good for its day, but the x3 scale they used was all wrong (in my not so humble opinion). This is a game about CARS! It is a word that deals in VISUAL IMPACT when rating the quality of a game. Thus...

The game should be scaled so that an automobile in the game is roughly the same size as a HOTWHEELS or MATCHBOX car that can be purchased at Wallmart for $0.85 a piece... Alternatively, scale it to the MICROMACHINES. It really does no matter what major line of miniature cars you choose... Perhaps, in order to keep them from rolling about on their own, sell small plastic bases to put the HotWheels or Matchbox or Micromachines cars onto...

But if you do this, make the game scale to the minitaure car market, you instantly have 10,000+ miniatures for your game the day it releases. Heck, see if you can get HotWheels or Matchbox or Micromachines to be a business partner on the deal, they might even be willing to release a special AMERICAN AUTODUEL ASSOCIATION line... Even the busted up, half-functional cars could serve as wrecks in the game... This is one of those things that just (to me) seems like such a no-brainer, that I am surprised that the last version did not do this.

[tsykoduk]

5th ed did the matchbox scale. We did use matchbox cars in our frequent games (and big d6's for altitude counters hehehe). It was a total blast..

The only real thing that I would like to see is a 5th ed design rules set.

Just my opinion and YMMV

[Execudork]

Originally Posted by KDLadage

I cannot say this loudly enough:

SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE SCALE

The original game (1" = 15') was good for its day, but the x3 scale they used was all wrong (in my not so humble opinion). This is a game about CARS! It is a word that deals in VISUAL IMPACT when rating the quality of a game.

...I am surprised that the last version did not do this.

Um, did you look at the latest version of the game? It is in matchbox scale. Take the original 1" cars, multiply all dimensions by 3 (in effect, x9). You get a car 3" long, 1.5" wide.

Now pick up your $0.85 matchbox toy from WalMart... measure it. You'll find it's nearly exactly 3" long, and 1.5" wide. Too close to be coincidence - somebody was thinking about this.

The original scale is good for one thing - big events. Hammer Downs or any of the "use-all-the-road-bits-you-have" race tracks are simply too large for the average player to setup in matchbox scale. I discovered that a really well-stocked model-railroad store will sell scenery for N scale - which is 1" = 15 feet. The only downside to the perfect little plastic cars is their price. Seems N scale isn't very popular amoung railroad-enthusiasts, so each cheap-plastic car costs about $5.00. sigh.

***EDIT***

I dug out one of my matchbox cars and actually measured it. My little replica Ford Mustang is 3" long, but only slightly more than 1" wide. I think the scale still fits, since real cars are not usually 1/2 as wide as they are long. 1/3 seems more appropriate (except perhaps for something like a HUMMER)

[KDLadage]

Yes, I looked at the current cersion of the game... And when I looked at the card-stock cars, perhaps it was some trick of the 2d format, but they looked (to me anyway) considerably larger than that. I no longer have the game (as I really did not care for the play) so I cannot look it over again.

If it was in Matchbox/Hotwheels scale and I missed that, then color me stupid... nothing to see here folks, move along, move along...

[Mahdimael]

As far as the current version of the game, the cars actually are different sizes- compact cars like the killer kart are smaller than the luxury vehicles or midsize ones. They're all large enough that you can mount the matchbox car on a piece of cardboard (no rolling).