Attack Options Breakdown

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Anders

The thought strikes me that some pointers on when to use which attack option would be useful. If written by someone qualified.

While I don't really count as "someone qualified," I thought I might go ahead and get the ball rolling on this one.
Many of the below options are not from GURPS Basic Set. Telegraphic Attack, Defensive Feint, Targeted Attack (as a Technique), Combinations, Defensive Attack, and Committed Attack are from GURPS Martial Arts, while the Setup Attack is from Pyramid #3/52. Trademark Move is from GURPS Power Ups 2: Perks.

Attack Options

Telegraphic Attack: This is the go-to when your foe has no ability to defend themselves. Additionally, if your effective skill is less than 12, Telegraphic Attack is often a good idea. Telegraphic Attack is also great with allies around - you can get your target to waste a good defense (like Block or Parry) so your buddies can capitalize on it later.

Deceptive Attack: DA is simply a default fallback - if you've got enough skill left after taking other options, pump as much as you're comfortable with into DA. Others can give (and have) a more detailed breakdown, but in general you want to try to keep your skill between 14 and 17 (16 is arguably ideal, thanks to the increased chance of a Critical Hit and decreased chance of a Critical Miss). Dropping down to 12 is good in some cases, but those are fairly rare (and it's often impossible to determine if you're in one of those cases, as you usually don't know your foe's exact defense score). Don't drop to 10 or 11 unless you're willing to burn some Luck. These skill breakpoints apply to any of the options that cause a penalty.
If you've got allies, then even against a foe who outclasses you DA can be worth it - it is more likely to cause them to use their best defense (rather than getting away with Dodge) to avoid it, which will open them up a bit more, allowing your allies a chance at actually hitting them.

Setup Attack: Setup Attack should be used to, well, set up a later high-value attack. The "high-value" part is important. The way the mechanics of Setup Attack are designed, any Setup that actually results in a later defense penalty would have hit outright as a Deceptive Attack. A Setup Attack on the Torso followed up by a Deceptive Attack on the Torso is typically a waste of time - if you'd have taken the same penalty on the first attack as a DA, you would have hit the Torso on that attack. Rather, Setup Attack should be used to allow you to, for example, stab a heavily-armored foe in the eye while still imposing a decent defense penalty. You'll typically want to aim at the Torso for the Setup Attack, although if you think you've got a decent chance at hitting another location (or if your foe is so heavily armored at the Torso he'll just ignore the Setup), by all means go for it.
An exception to the recommendation of not doing a Setup and the follow up against the same location is when there is something special about the follow up - perhaps it uses a more damaging weapon or maneuver. In this case, you're giving up a minor wound now for a fight-ending one later, so it's worth it.
If your GM allows you to share your Setup with others, it's a similar situation as above - the weak-but-skilled character can do a Setup Attack that allows his obscenely-strong ally to cut the foe down.

Feint: Feint is useful when you outclass your foe's skill but he still has a solid defense. Perhaps he's using Defensive Attack, a shield, and/or some rule that allows him to focus on defending a certain hit location - annoyingly, the very one you need to hit. A good Feint followed by a Targeted and/or Deceptive Attack can end a fight. As with Setup Attacks, if you can share your Feint with others you can trick a foe into opening himself up to an ally's attack.
Feint can also be used defensively, which is good if you're suffering some defense penalties and/or simply need to hold off the foe. If you don't outclass your foe's skill, however, you'll probably just want to stick to All Out Defense and/or Defensive Attack.

Rapid Strike: Rapid Strike - and its brother, Dual Weapon Attack - can be useful for engaging multiple foes at once. It's also decent for beating down a foe's defenses - every potential hit uses up a defense for the target, and the accruing penalties - and additional checks - can give you a decent shot of eventually hitting. If you've got a favorite Rapid Strike, consider making it a Combination and/or Trademark Move to get rid of some of the penalties.

Targeted Attack: Targeted Attacks let you take a skill penalty to target a high-value location. While the Deceptive Attack guidelines typically hold true, Targeted Attacks have such potential to end a fight outright it can occasionally be worth it to go below skill 12.
Skull: -7 is a hefty penalty, but any hit that gets past DR has a very good chance of ending the fight outright - a x4 WM means 2 penetrating damage is enough for a Major Wound on the majority of foes (HP 15 or less), and a Major Wound to the Skull requires an HT-10 roll against knockdown - and keep in mind that any failure by 5+ means the foe falls unconscious. Even if you don't inflict a Major Wound, your foe still has to make a straight HT roll against knockdown. Skull is a good candidate to invest in a Technique for, but you'll typically want swing damage to insure you can get past DR - particularly because the Skull is the easiest hit location to armor, so it often has very high DR.
Eye: At -9, Eye is Skull without the DR, and to add insult to severe injury will typically permanently blind the target in the struck eye. An excellent hit location, but typically only thrust damage works, so consider carefully. Also a good candidate for a Technique.
Face: At -5, the big advantages for Face are often low DR (full face coverage comes with a vision penalty) and the knockdown roll - HT on any wound of 1/10th HP or better, and HT-5 on a Major Wound. A decent candidate for a Technique.
Neck: At -5, Neck is often a much better hit location than Face - DR tends to be low, and both Crushing and Cutting damage gain increased wounding modifiers. Nothing special in terms of knockdown, however. A good candidate for a Technique.
Vitals: At -3, Vitals can be a great location to strike. It has the same knockdown rules as the Face, but Piercing, Impaling, and Burning (provided it's Tight Beam) get a higher WM, which can be a fight ender. Unfortunately, Vitals are also often (as part of the Torso) the most armored hit location on the body. A good candidate for a Technique.
Arms: At -2, Arms are good to target - while they can be decently well-armored (although typically not as much as the Skull and Torso), a single good hit can render a foe unable to use their weapon. As the penalty is so low, this actually isn't a good candidate for a Technique.
Hands: At -4, these are Arms with a lower crippling threshold and often lower DR. A decent candidate for a Technique.
Legs: At -2, Legs are good targets - a single good hit will render a foe unable to stand, which can easily mean they are no longer part of the fight. As with Arms, the low penalty means these aren't worth buying Targeted Attack for.
Feet: At -4, these are Legs with a lower crippling threshold, but typically just as high of DR. Some GM's might require you to use a weapon with decent Reach or be crouching to actually hit the Feet. A decent candidate for a Technique.

Attack Maneuvers

Attack: The default - you have full normal defenses and get to try and kill the other guy. The go-to option.

Defensive Attack: This gives you a bonus to defense but means your attacks will do less damage. This can be useful to make a foe use up a defense (so one of your allies can exploit the opening). It's also good if your weapon is so effective against your foes that you can easily suck up the damage penalty. It's also great if you don't actually care about how much damage a successful hit would do - Defensive Attack is great as a Setup Attack, as you boost your own defense while dropping your foe's; it's also great for poisoned weapons. Defensive Attack is also the go-to if you want to be able to swing your dueling halberd and still Parry with it.

Committed Attack: This is good to get an increased chance of harming your foe (either through Strong - getting past DR and HP - or Dedicated - actually hitting in the first place), and is also necessary if you want to get an extra Step to get into position. It's got some serious defense penalties, however, so be careful when using it. If you have very good backup Defenses, high enough DR you probably won't get harmed, or reason to believe your foes won't target you, Committed Attack can be well worth it. If you're trying to stop your foes from going after a vulnerable or important ally, this can do it - they'll exploit your opening instead. Committed Attack can also be a good way to open your foe for an ally to come in and finish them off.

All Out Attack: When you absolutely want your target dead, go with this - you can get a massive boost to chance to hit or damage, or get to attack twice at no penalty (or get some extra Reach, with Long). The problem is that you lose the ability to defend at all. This is great if there's almost no chance of your foes harming you next round, or if you had no chance to successfully defend anyway. As with Committed Attack, using All Out Attack can serve to "aggro" enemies, getting them to target you instead of your squishier friends, and it's also great for opening a foe so your buddies can kill them before they get a chance to exploit your defenseless state.

[Peter V. Dell'Orto]

Nice. You're as qualified as anyone to offer suggestions about when to use stuff!

Some nitpicks:

- It might be worth noting where those options are from. For example, Setup Attacks are from a Pyramid article, Telegraphic Attacks from GURPS Martial Arts, etc.

- "Targeted Attacks" is technically the term of art for a Technique from GURPS Martial Arts, not for aiming at a specific location. Hit Location (p. B398) is the term for aiming for a specific spot.

- It's Trademark Move, not Signature Move.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

Nice. You're as qualified as anyone to offer suggestions about when to use stuff!

Thanks. Unfortunately, my GURPS combat experience is pretty much purely from a theoretical/number crunching perspective. Notably, I tend to think of effective skill 14/15 as being the ideal point to shoot for, while from what I can tell those with actual play experience tend to gravitate toward either 12/13 ("Still a sure thing, right?") or 16/17 ("Crits, yo!").

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

It might be worth noting where those options are from. For example, Setup Attacks are from a Pyramid article, Telegraphic Attacks from GURPS Martial Arts, etc.

Point. I'll edit the above to note where everything is from.

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

"Targeted Attacks" is technically the term of art for a Technique from GURPS Martial Arts, not for aiming at a specific location. Hit Location (p. B398) is the term for aiming for a specific spot.

Good to know, but I'll just leave it as-is. I don't think anyone will get confused.

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

It's Trademark Move, not Signature Move.

Ah, thanks. I'll edit that in while I'm at it.


One thing I failed to note above is the possibility of using Setup Attack defensively. Now, this isn't actually included in the Pyramid article, but it doesn't seem a stretch to take the rules for Defensive Feints and applying them to Setup Attacks. Combining Defensive Attack with Defensive Setup can be a very good idea when up against a foe you really can't afford to be hit by.

[DouglasCole]

While Deceptive Attacks do not stack with Telegraphic Attacks, Setup Attacks DO. Also, a Setup Attack is an actual attack, so it's a bit of a two-fer.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Varyon

All Out Attack: ... This is great if there's almost no chance of your foes harming you next round,

Enough armor can get you here, of course. It's great to AoA when you have DR12+ on most locations and fighting guys who are mostly doing 1d damage (as long as they lack the skill to reliably stab you in the eyes, of course).

[Kalzazz]

Ill admit I would like to see much more examples and discussion of Setup Attacks, the rules are easy and simple, but I haven't really been able to figure out where I would really want to use them instead of a Deceptive Attack or a Feint . . . I am sure there is a use for them, but its definitely been to slippery for me to grasp

The neat thing about all these building blocks is that you can put them all together. And then you can even use Extra Effort for more puzzle pieces! Use a Dedicated All Out Attack for +4 to skill. Use Rapid Strike for 2 attacks at -3 (if you have Weapon Master), use Extra Effort (Flurry of Blows) to reduce that to -1, then take one of those attacks and use as a Feint and the other as a Deceptive swing to skull! This amusing combo was my Seelie Knight in the Kansas City 18XX campaign I was in favorite move, named 'Attack That Ends the Battle' and was used more often then not when only one enemy remained to try to finish them in a single round

Of course, almost as often as not the moved resulting in my character getting toasted because of fwishing the attack or having it defended and then eating a Telegraphic attack in return, but it was highly successful at the 'ending the battle' bit!

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

Ill admit I would like to see much more examples and discussion of Setup Attacks, the rules are easy and simple, but I haven't really been able to figure out where I would really want to use them instead of a Deceptive Attack or a Feint . . . I am sure there is a use for them, but its definitely been to slippery for me to grasp

From what I can tell, Setup Attacks are best for when you need to hit some hard-to-hit, high-value target. The example from the article is pretty good - the necromancer has a hard-to-hit gemstone on his chest, which he's emphasizing protection of*, and Indigo needs to destroy that to stop the necromancer's undead army. Let's say Indigo has Rapier-23 and Weapon Master, and the gemstone is around -7 or so to hit. Now, he could try to hit the gemstone outright, but that drops his skill to 16 - little room for a Deceptive Attack (he could manage -2 or -4, although that typically wouldn't really boost his chance to hit, thanks to the decreased chance of a crit), and his foe has a pretty serious Parry for protecting that stone. Thanks to the necromancer emphasizing defense of the gemstone*, however, a hit to the leg has a pretty serious penalty to defend against. Indigo opts for a Rapid Strike - a skill 12 Setup Attack to the Leg (he's more intent on imposing a penalty than on fully connecting, so dropping to 12 may be worth it) followed by a skill 13 (I'd allow a partial Telegraphic Attack, at skill 15, but that's just me) thrust to the gemstone. He connects with the first attack, imposing a -3 penalty to defend against the second. His foe has already Parried, however, so he's actually facing a total of between -4 (fencing weapon and Weapon Master) and -7 (neither) to that.

*No official rules for this that I'm aware of, but offhand something like "+1 to defend this hit location, -1 to defend everywhere else" would work. It may be more appropriate to allow characters to distribute defense priorities as they see fit; I'll see if I can work something up...
EDIT: A fairly simple rule would be to allow the character to emphasize defense of upper body (Head, Neck, Torso, Arms, Hands) at +1 in exchange for -1 to defend lower body (Legs/Feet) or vice versa. The character can then emphasize one hit location to get an extra +1 to it and -1 everywhere else, and if applicable a sublocation for a further +1/-1. So, our necromancer is emphasizing Upper Body, then further to Torso, then further still to the Heartstone sublocation. That's going to be a +3 to the Heartstone (+1 Upper, +1 Torso, +1 Heartstone), +1 to the Torso (+1 Upper, +1 Torso, -1 Heartstone), -1 to Head/Neck/Arms/Hands (+1 Upper, -1 Torso, -1 Heartstone), and -3 to Legs/Feet (-1 Upper, -1 Torso, -1 Heartstone). It's up to the GM if this applies to all defenses or just one - I'd probably go with all for most characters, a choice of just one or all for characters with Combat Reflexes, and the ability to fully differentiate different defenses for characters with ETS. An example of the last would be a character emphasizing Head with Parry, Upper Body with Block, and Lower Body with Dodge.

[Peter V. Dell'Orto]

Originally Posted by Varyon

From what I can tell, Setup Attacks are best for when you need to hit some hard-to-hit, high-value target.

Pretty much, in situations when you'd also benefit from Feint. If you need lots of effective skill to hit a target, both Feint and Setup Attack allow you to keep that effective skill high by offloading the penalty-inducing stuff to a different roll.

This is why "Feint, then attack his eyeslits at -10!" comes up so often in games I've played - it's hard to make a heavily-penalized attack highly Deceptive, so you need to find a way to move the penalties elsewhere. Setup Attack does the same, but replaces Feint in the process, because Doug has this secret hatred of Feints. ;)

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

Pretty much, in situations when you'd also benefit from Feint. If you need lots of effective skill to hit a target, both Feint and Setup Attack allow you to keep that effective skill high by offloading the penalty-inducing stuff to a different roll.

Yep. The advantages to Setup Attack over Feint are a) it uses the foe's actual current defense ability, not his ability to resist Feints, b) it forces the foe to use up a defense, penalizing them further in the case of a Rapid Strike (and helping allies out even more as well), and c) it can actually harm the foe while you beat him down.

Originally Posted by Peter V. Dell'Orto

Setup Attack does the same, but replaces Feint in the process, because Doug has this secret hatred of Feints. ;)

For those who share this secret hatred - or at least simply like the Setup Attack mechanics better - there's this.


Incidentally, as it ran the risk of derailing the thread, I've made my musings on focusing defense into their own thread.

[Anders]

Thanks Varyon. I will follow this closely.