The 2010 e23 Releases and Speculation Thread

[RevBob]

Originally Posted by Alacrity Fitzhugh

Really looking forward to Horror...

...which is just not something one hears all that often. :)

[Daeglan]

What is Gurps Social Engineering?

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Daeglan

What is Gurps Social Engineering?

The book that does for social position and interaction rules what GURPS Martial Arts did for the combat rules. Or attempts to.

Bill Stoddard

[Langy]

The book that does for social position and interaction rules what GURPS Martial Arts did for the combat rules. Or attempts to.

That sounds awesome. Any hint as to how long it'll be or any clues as to the types of things we'll see? I'm guessing nowhere near Martial Arts' length, but I'm having a hard time thinking of the types of things we'd see in a 'Social Engineering' book. Maybe some techniques for social skills? *shrug*

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Langy

That sounds awesome. Any hint as to how long it'll be or any clues as to the types of things we'll see? I'm guessing nowhere near Martial Arts' length, but I'm having a hard time thinking of the types of things we'd see in a 'Social Engineering' book. Maybe some techniques for social skills? *shrug*

Sorry, no hints. The content is not mine to reveal.

But if it encourages you any, I've been running campaigns heavy in social interaction since around 1992, when I began a RuneQuest campaign in the Griffin Mountain setting. So I've spent a lot of time on it.

Bill Stoddard

[Prime Evil]

Originally Posted by whswhs

The book that does for social position and interaction rules what GURPS Martial Arts did for the combat rules. Or attempts to.

Bill Stoddard

It sounds like an interesting concept. And I will definitely buy it. But I wonder whether quantifying social interaction in game terms is a good idea. Isn't there always a risk that it will encourage lazy roleplaying where players substitute dice rolls for meaningful interaction with NPCs? I suppose that I worry that it will give players tools to 'short-circuit' scenes designed to encourage them to interact with NPCs in character.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by Prime Evil

It sounds like an interesting concept. And I will definitely buy it. But I wonder whether quantifying social interaction in game terms is a good idea. Isn't there always a risk that it will encourage lazy roleplaying where players substitute dice rolls for meaningful interaction with NPCs? I suppose that I worry that it will give players tools to 'short-circuit' scenes designed to encourage them to interact with NPCs in character.

1) You're assuming some groups don't already use social skill rolls to resolve these situations.

2) There is a significant population of gamers who just aren't socially skilled themselves. They would like to play socially skilled characters, just like they'd like to play mighty thewed barbarians or space aliens or all the other things they aren't in real life. Game mecahnics are an important way of making sure "That One Guy" who's good at talking isn't the only guy who gets to be the Face Man.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Bruno

2) There is a significant population of gamers who just aren't socially skilled themselves. They would like to play socially skilled characters, just like they'd like to play mighty thewed barbarians or space aliens or all the other things they aren't in real life. Game mecahnics are an important way of making sure "That One Guy" who's good at talking isn't the only guy who gets to be the Face Man.

That's an important reason, and an admirably clear statement of it. But there's a second reason that's important, too: We have the option in GURPS of playing larger than life characters, characters whose skills and natural qualities are way beyond normal limits. One way to be such a character is to be incredibly good at social perception, communication, persuasion, and similar skills. Even the best roleplayers are not likely to actually be at that level of social skill, or to be able to improvise the dialogue and social interactions of characters who are. "Just roleplay" isn't a complete answer in that case.

I'd also note that game mechanics can be a way of encouraging people to roleplay more. If you know that your character is going to succeed or fail based on how good your improv is, and you're a bit socially awkward, you may be hesitant to try social interaction in the first place; if the GM is doing to ask you for a dice roll, and maybe give you a bonus if you come up with good dialogue, the risk is lessened and the reward is boosted.

Bill Stoddard

[Steven Marsh]

A few points:

1) I would intend (and hope) such a book would allow for folks to play characters who aren't as socially adept as their players. This is already the default for physical/martial encounters; I don't need to be a black belt in karate or a sharpshooting expert to play a hero who is. So, ideally, these rules should allow a hero who can (say) determine if someone can be bribed, or seduce someone who's borderline willing, or give an inspiring speech to the crowd, even if his player can't.

2) Other games with detailed social interaction rules still tend to have a lot of socializing. (White Wolf's products spring to mind, although there are others.)

3) Even if there are rules, the players still need to describe and explain what they're doing, even if they're using existing rules. I'd no more allow "I'm using my Sex Appeal skill to get information from the bartender" than I'd allow "I'm using my Broadsword skill to make the guard fall over."

4) Even groups that don't want or need these rules normally may enjoy using them sometimes -- say, for when they're trying to speed through a scene of lesser importance to get to the Good Stuff.

5) Besides, often the best aspects of social interaction are those that involve choices: Do you reveal the truth about your mission to the sympathetic resistance leader? Do you try to form a relationship with the guard you just seduced? Do you use your social maneuvering to try to run for public office? Although the success or failure of these decisions might be determined by dice, the emotional and interactive cruxes of them aren't... which should still make for good gaming.

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by whswhs

The book that does for social position and interaction rules what GURPS Martial Arts did for the combat rules. Or attempts to.

Bill Stoddard

Potentially dangerous social interaction? Sounds like GURPS Marital Arts. ;)

(It does sound intriguing; I'll keep an eye out. And that's from someone who does tend to be a bit of an improv actor. )