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Old 06-06-2017, 02:05 AM   #11
Blue Ghost
 
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

A real life example are people who are legally declared schizophrenic, with a typical symptom being that they believe their minds are being read with "microwave" technology. Ergo crazies who wear tin foil hats.

The truth of the matter is that it's a psychiatric technique to discover why someone is acting out by drugging them up. You can get a subject to talk in their sleep about their daily thoughts, and toss it back in their face in casual conversation. The cumulative effect is that they believe they have no privacy (which they don't due to doctor and/or court order).

It's actually a facet of Traveller, as it seems to have riffs on security and law enforcement themes as seeds for adventures. So called "psionics" stemming from this practice.
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Old 06-06-2017, 06:12 AM   #12
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
Anne McCaffrey's "To Ride Pegasus" [Followed by "Pegasus in Flight" "Get off Unicorn" and "Pegasus in Space" collectively know as her Talents Series] cover the Societal arch from Psi first being Verifiable Documented, and the Journey to go from prejudice to just one more accented minority in security.
Though only the first of them predates Traveller. I suspect the most discussed work with a persecuted psis theme around the time Traveller was being written would have been Katherine Kurtz Deryni series. Society hates and persecutes psis is not a rare theme in SF.

The bit that may be original to Traveller are the Psionic Institutes, I can't actually think of a precedent for those - there are organizations that train people that are *already* psis, but the teach anybody model, and the related concept that anybody can join this persecuted minority by attending one, seems new. Though of course it follows the religious persecution model quite well - underground religious academies that seduce our children into their evil cult certainly aren't an unprecedented fear.
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Old 06-06-2017, 07:03 AM   #13
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

Would this have literary sources, cinematic sources, or both?

There are quite a few 1950s and 1960s atomic-horror movies where somebody gained powers that nowadays we would call psionic, and was persecuted and hunted because of those powers - some of those movies ended up on MST3K. The "powers are evil" attitude also appeared on television shows of the time (for example, the second pilot episode of Star Trek).
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Old 06-06-2017, 07:27 AM   #14
Andrew Hackard
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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A real life example are people who are legally declared schizophrenic, with a typical symptom being that they believe their minds are being read with "microwave" technology. Ergo crazies who wear tin foil hats.
"Crazy" is offensive in this context and not everyone who believes in mind control is mentally ill.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:04 AM   #15
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

Well many apologies, mister Hackard, it wasn't meant to be. It is an actual psychiatric technique.
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Old 06-06-2017, 11:57 AM   #16
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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I've been digging into the source literature that inspired Traveller (see, inter alia, Deciphering the Text Foundations of Traveller). I've found some interesting insights, which I'm still digesting.

One thing I haven't found, however, is an antecedent for Traveller's public prejudice against psionics. Some works (e.g., Andre Norton's) have criminals with psionic abilities. It also seems to be widely accepted in these sources that a crime is a crime, whether it is committed by a psychic or by mundane means. The idea that the mere use of psionics is objectionable and may result in lobotomy or death has not appeared in anything I've read so far.

Is this original to Marc Miller and company? It makes sense from a game balance perspective: it's a fairly simple way to keep the game from revolving around developing and using psionic abilities (unless that's what you want to do).

If not, what are the literary sources or inspirations for this feature? Remember, the source would have had to be available prior to 1977, since the section on "public prejudice" appears in the first edition (and, indeed, pre-dates the OTU).
For the matter of that do you have examples of a psiocracy that would seem oppressive to anyone not immersed in it? Actually yes, the Tripods trilogy. Though that included an attempted genocide of humans, and so was oppressive by any standard. Zho are not saints and few non-Zho would want to live under their system but they have never gone to such a point.

In any case Traveller had an elegant arrangement wherein psi were an oligarchy in one empire and a persecuted minority in a rival one.
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Old 06-06-2017, 01:49 PM   #17
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
Anne McCaffrey's "To Ride Pegasus" ...
That is possible, although the rest of the series wasn't published until the 1990's. The Center may have served as a model for the Psionic Institutes as well.

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
There's some possibility of influence from Witches of Karres though the psi "Klaatha magic" is very high powered there. Also, Schmitz' Telzey Amberdon series.
These appear to also be possible, although I'm not familiar with them. Thanks for the pointer.

Quote:
Another possibility would be Niven's Known Space series. It at least has psis and has to have had some influence on Traveller.

There was some occaisional psi in the Van Rijn/Flandry universe of Poul Anderson and that's influence on Traveller would be difficult to deny.
On the other hand, these -- while explicitly cited as inspirational for Traveller -- don't have the overt public prejudice aspect to psionics that I'm trying to source.

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Originally Posted by robkelk View Post
Would this have literary sources, cinematic sources, or both?
The cited sources are strongly literary. The only exceptions are Star Wars and Star Trek, which I think we can agree are only peripheral influences at best.

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Originally Posted by jason taylor View Post
In any case Traveller had an elegant arrangement wherein psi were an oligarchy in one empire and a persecuted minority in a rival one.
Mostly irrelevant to the current discussion, as these features came much later in Traveller's development. Both the Psionic Institutes and public prejudice against psionics were there from the beginning.
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Old 06-06-2017, 01:58 PM   #18
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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Though only the first of them predates Traveller. I suspect the most discussed work with a persecuted psis theme around the time Traveller was being written would have been Katherine Kurtz Deryni series. Society hates and persecutes psis is not a rare theme in SF.
I'd be reluctant to use that, psi in the Deryni uses an awful lot of traditional magical symbolism, rather than making an attempt to be faux-scientific.
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The bit that may be original to Traveller are the Psionic Institutes, I can't actually think of a precedent for those.
The Xavier Institute.
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Old 06-06-2017, 02:48 PM   #19
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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The Xavier Institute.
... for Gifted Youngsters? I agree with malloyd, this is the usual: a school for people with already identified paranormal abilities. The ability comes first, and mutants are distinct from the general populace.

We're looking for a setting where (1) virtually everyone has psionic potential, (2) an "extremely low profile" organization exists to test and train that potential, and (3) "[t]he climate of public opinion about psionics is extremely negative."
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Old 06-06-2017, 03:52 PM   #20
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Default Re: Literary source for anti-psionics prejudice?

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... for Gifted Youngsters? I agree with malloyd, this is the usual: a school for people with already identified paranormal abilities. The ability comes first, and mutants are distinct from the general populace.

We're looking for a setting where (1) virtually everyone has psionic potential, (2) an "extremely low profile" organization exists to test and train that potential, and (3) "[t]he climate of public opinion about psionics is extremely negative."
I'm inclined to believe that these three elements, taken together, are original to Traveller; that is, without literary antecedent.
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