[Magic] Stop Bleeding spell

[Kazander]

Okay, after playing the game for years, I'm still not clear on why the Stop Bleeding spell even exists.

The Healing spells appear to be superior in every way. Stop Bleeding is not a prequisite for any of them.

Is the argument supposed to be that you have to cast Stop Bleeding before you can cast a Healing spell? This isn't stated, and I fail to see how magical Healing could possibly heal someone without stopping the bleeding.

Just an idle question that's been bugging me today. :-)

[Turhan's Bey Company]

Unlike the Healing spells, it doesn't suffer penalties for repeated casting. It's useful for getting someone stable multiple times during a series of combats over a short period. Not your go-to spell, by any stretch, but it's good to have on hand if you're expecting people to get hurt repeatedly.

[Kromm]

Spells such as Minor and Major Healing cure injury. When used to cure a wound that happens to be bleeding, they also stop bleeding. However, if bleeding is the primary effect – not caused by an injury, but the cause of ongoing HP loss – then you can use Minor or Major Healing to treat the HP loss, but this won't stop the bleeding, which in this case is akin to an affliction, not an injury. For that, you need Stop Bleeding. Causes of bleeding without injury usually only exist in fantasy . . . but then, the same goes for spells.

An equally niche but sometimes useful application is when you've cast all your serious Healing spells on a friend who has been in a lot of fights, and now the cumulative -3 per casting has you in a situation where you can't heal him any more without risking critical failure. In that contingency, healing 1 HP and preventing further HP loss to bleeding is a lot better than doing nothing.

[Turhan's Bey Company]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Causes of bleeding without injury usually only exist in fantasy . . . but then, the same goes for spells.

Hmm. A cure for the epistle of Paul to the Galatians...

[starslayer]

Another potential use of stop bleeding is that you may have a target with a MASSIVE number of hit points, and an equally massive injury, more then you conceivably heal before bleeding become an issue.

Good example might be attempting to heal a dragon after it has been lanced by a knight on a charging warhorse with a spiked lance, coated in anti-coagulants. The dragon could be down a hundred hit point and still alive <depending on how big the dragon is it may even have still been able to fight>- but now combat is done, and healing a hundred hit points before the bleeding stops would be quite the feat, and the anti-coagulants will prevent normal healing from helping, so either the dragon gets healed to full with magical healing, or the bleeding continues- unless you use stop bleeding.

It also notes for stop bleeding that 10 energy will stabilize a mortal wound, which depending on GM may cover 'I failed my death check, but am technically still able to be alive' if administered immediately (failing a death check at least in my games does not represent 'immediate death', but instead critical injury causing the ceasing of vital organs like the heart; CPR and other life saving skills still have a chance to recover the downed individual until accumulating damage from oxygen starvation to organs and brain exceed -5*hp; so casting the ten point version of stop bleeding in my game would give you a magically stablized individual on the cusp of death, giving you a much larger window to find some way to replace lost blood/organs and restart the heart or otherwise reverse the damage caused).


edit;
Just one more note; stop bleeding may not count as 'healing yourself' (Since it is really only magical bandaging); and thus a wizard can cast it on themselves without incurring the -damage to skill penalty

[Kazander]

Thanks for the responses!

I admit, the possibility of bleeding without injury never occurred to me. :-)

[rosignol]

Originally Posted by Kazander

Okay, after playing the game for years, I'm still not clear on why the Stop Bleeding spell even exists.

The 1-point casting is basically a free point of healing (if skill is 15+) that doesn't cause penalities for Minor/Major healing, the 10-point casting will allow a character to re-roll a failed death check (or maybe it stabilizes them automagically, IDHMBWM).

Both applications are useful.

[Bruno]

Stop Bleeding is also the only cheap easy spell I can think of that stabilizes a mortal wound.

[simply Nathan]

Back when I was using prerequisite chains, I simply erased Lend Vitality and moved Stop Bleeding to its place.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by rosignol

The 1-point casting is basically a free point of healing (if skill is 15+) that doesn't cause penalities for Minor/Major healing, the 10-point casting will allow a character to re-roll a failed death check (or maybe it stabilizes them automagically, IDHMBWM).

"Mortal Wound" is what occurs when you fail a death check by 2 or less. The page ref is B.423.

With a HT check (counting mods like Very Fit and Hard to Kill) of 16+ you never drop isntantly dead until -5x HT.

There's a really nice thing about the stop Bleeding Item that prevents all Mortal Wounds.

Confronted with a player called Nyx the Barbarian who had such a Ht roll and acquired a stop Bleeding item I started a thread a while ago called "A subtle question of magic and death" that explored these interactions.

It turned out that I needn't have worried about these rules questions as Nyx alwasy ddi unto others before the others had much of a chance to do unto her.

Anyway, a Stop Bleeding Enchnted Item is always on my list of things to acquire. Comparativley cheap too.