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Old 10-04-2017, 07:42 PM   #11
dripton
 
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

Depends on how many PCs you have. With 4+ PCs, I like niche protection, to make sure that everyone gets to shine. With 3- PCs, it's hard to cover all the niches, and it's easier for everyone to get a word in, so I'd err on the side of letting people be generalists if the GM wants. (If you'd rather keep things simple that's fine too, but you might need to bring some NPCs along.)
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Old 10-04-2017, 07:53 PM   #12
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

I think for Yrth, I would just come up with some Magical Styles (including adapting existing ones) and include a few styles with Healing spells and several with Clerical Investment. As with Dungeon Styles, I would make templates for stylists. These would replace the cleric, druid, and wizard templates completely.

Holy Warriors probably need to be replaced as well. While knights and wizards (notably Templars) of militant orders fill some of the role of the holy warrior, you probably want a wholly new mystic template for the people who have mystical powers.

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Old 10-04-2017, 09:19 PM   #13
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

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Eh, honestly, I just hate D&D's arbitrary "Wizards can't learn Healing spells, that's what Clerics are for" restriction. One of the reasons I like GURPS is that it's spell-based magic system allows for a Spellcaster to have the freedom to learn whatever spells they want.
Same here. I allow spellcasters in my games learn whatever spells they want. No problems in my game. I throw out the clerical/druid prereqs and make up what I think would be prereqs based on the PI level needed.

I leave the templates though. I feel like the other skills give them a good enough flavor to be different from each other class
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Old 10-05-2017, 08:42 AM   #14
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

I'd consider this not on a rules and world-design basis, but as a result of player dynamics.

EG, if only one player is willing to play a caster, but the group is beginning to argue about how they need more than one caster type and try to pressure another player into doing something they don't want to.

Or EG if I only have two or three players, the players are anxious about the lack of variety, and we've decided not to go the multiple-PC or NPC sidekick/hireling route.

I'm perfectly happy to run a game with no spell casters, or all clerics, or any other party composition my players come up with. It's based on what's sucking the fun out for my players that I'd patch this on.
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Old 10-05-2017, 10:54 AM   #15
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

If I wanted to allow Wizards to do healing, I would add Lend Vitality to them, and allow them the entry level healing spell that only works on themselves. This would keep the Clerics healing abilities powerful enough to be appealing, but allow small parties some healing ability.
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:49 PM   #16
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

It seems to me that, if someone in the group wants to play a cleric or a druid, giving wizards access to cleric or druid spells is obviously stepping on that person's toes. If, on the other hand, you have a group where no one wants to play a cleric, giving the wizard access to basic healing spells is only going to be beneficial to group dynamics. After all, even if one were to combine all three primary spellcasters into a single template, that would still leave eight other professions for people to play.

(I have heard that, in D&D, it used to be a stereotype that every group wanted to have a cleric to run support and patch up injuries but no one wanted to play that cleric. If any group ran into such a problem, letting a wizard cast those spells would be a solution, and one a point-based game is ideally suited to easily implement.)
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:54 PM   #17
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

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If, on the other hand, you have a group where no one wants to play a cleric, giving the wizard access to basic healing spells is only going to be beneficial to group dynamics.
Or you can set something up that means no-one in the party needs to be the heal-bot.
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:56 PM   #18
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

I much prefer the PCs hiring NPCs to fill unfilled roles than changing the setting arbitrarily in order to make those roles disappear.
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:10 PM   #19
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Or you can set something up that means no-one in the party needs to be the heal-bot.
If you can point me towards advice on how to manage this, please do. My general experience is that Dungeon Fantasy (meaning the genre, not this particular game) is, almost by definition, a combat focused game, so PCs (unless they are consistently faced with very underwhelming opponents) will sometimes take injuries, so (barring truly over the top rates of natural healing) one will either need to have a healer or gloss over months of time spent sitting around and recuperating.

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I much prefer the PCs hiring NPCs to fill unfilled roles than changing the setting arbitrarily in order to make those roles disappear.
Trivial response to that: The Dungeon Fantasy Roleplaying Game has a setting?

Slightly less trivial response: Is it any more unreasonable than arbitrarily designing the setting such that those roles appear?

Nontrivial response: Certainly, if a GM feels that the setting is enhanced by dividing up magic into different professions, then he should go ahead and do so- and the rules take that route by default. It should be noted, though, that the motif of secular magic excluding healing and animal manipulation is by no means universal in fiction or folklore (indeed, I cannot offhand think of examples of it in sources that are not either games or directly referencing games). Moreover, since the ability to customize templates in a simple and balanced manner is an advantage the Dungeon Fantasy Roleplaying Game has over more strictly class-based systems, I feel it worthwhile to point this out as an example of how said advantage can be gainfully utilized.
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:39 PM   #20
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Default Re: Dungeon Fantasy with only one Spellcaster "Class"

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Trivial response to that: The Dungeon Fantasy Roleplaying Game has a setting?
My campaign has a setting. If heretofore magic worked thusly, I would much rather the PCs hire a guy that can do the kind of magic they need rather than change the existing rules of magic.

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Slightly less trivial response: Is it any more unreasonable than arbitrarily designing the setting such that those roles appear?
Yes, because arbitrarily changing the setting to match the player characters undermines any sense of verisimilitude or challenge. For me part of the fun of this genre in particular is facing unexpected threats and challenges with insufficient resources. If not having a thief guarantees that you won't face locks or traps, not having a holy warrior means no ghosts or demons with Possession, not having any strong melee fighters means easy fights, and so on then the game just isn't going to be fun for me. The party composition and planning really shouldn't be predictive of the dungeon.

Hiring specialists is a key resource management technique, with a long history in the genre, and one that I think is frequently overlooked nowadays for some reason. I try to actively encourage it whenever I can.

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