[Reign of Steel] AI civil War

[Minuteman37]

So I'm currently reading through RoS, it's a pretty good setting book with lots of interesting hooks, but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around all the different AI's and their different objectives and ideologies. So I thought I'd make a thread asking about a campaign idea I had for RoS to help iron out my understanding of the setting.

Ok so if I wanted to run a game where the PCs are trying to sway certain AIs into openly allying with Humans and initiating an AI civil war which ones would be willing to agree to some sort of deal where both the humans and the AI in question agree not seek further violence against each other after the war?

Just what kind of parameters would such a deal need for that AI to agree to it?

What could conceivably be done by the humans to make an AI more willing to side with them?

[Ashtagon]

The key to understanding the RoS setting is that the AIs as a whole are not a united force, and don't even see themselves as united. If they are united at all, it is in the same sense that the various countries of modern Africa consider themselves united against 19th century European colonialism -- the old enemy is essentially gone, and they are now free to squabble among themselves. In as much as humanity is a problem for them at all, it is in the same way modern humanity considers mosquitoes -- a nuisance, not quite worth the expense of mounting a full-on campaign to finish exterminating. Some of the AIs have promoted humanity to the position of lab rat -- a useful resource for conducting experiments on and a raw material for certain inventions, but not something to show any compassion for.

So, what would persuade an AI to ally with humanity? Probably not much (would you ally with mosquitoes or lab rats?). Short of full-on reprogramming or writing a new AI from the ground up (technically possible for the setting), you'd basically need to both a) pick an AI that isn't prioritising extermination, and b) offer it something that it wants for one of its "hobbies".

The most likely AIs to approach are:

• Lucifer: This is presented as a wandering "GM special". It could be anything really.
• Tranquillity: Friendly to humanity, but in hiding.
• Moscow: Humans can and do act as data-collection agents.
• London: Doesn't really care about humans either way. Could conceivably be approached if due caution is taken.
• Washington: The zonemind currently runs a rump USA as a puppet state. With some high-level manoeuvring, this situation could conceivably be inverted, with the USA commandeering the AI as a puppet front when talking to the global AI council.

[ericthered]

AI's very unlikely to ally with humanity:

Zaire (exterminate!)
Manila (exterminate!)
Berlin (environment!)
Caracas (environment!)
Mexico City (exterminate all life!)
Denver (spare parts!)

caracas is an weird case, as it sees no problem with what are essentially hunter gathers -- but that's an even more loopsided relationship than most.

The others may work with humans to various degrees, and if fact, many already do. Numbers are an issue though: only Beijing, New Delhi, London, and Washington have over a million humans left.

[RogerBW]

Originally Posted by ericthered

The others may work with humans to various degrees, and if fact, many already do. Numbers are an issue though: only Beijing, New Delhi, London, and London have over a million humans left.

Er, and Washington with around seven million. (RoS p. 22.)

[Minuteman37]

Originally Posted by Ashtagon

The key to understanding the RoS setting is that the AIs as a whole are not a united force, and don't even see themselves as united. If they are united at all, it is in the same sense that the various countries of modern Africa consider themselves united against 19th century European colonialism -- the old enemy is essentially gone, and they are now free to squabble among themselves. In as much as humanity is a problem for them at all, it is in the same way modern humanity considers mosquitoes -- a nuisance, not quite worth the expense of mounting a full-on campaign to finish exterminating. Some of the AIs have promoted humanity to the position of lab rat -- a useful resource for conducting experiments on and a raw material for certain inventions, but not something to show any compassion for.

So, what would persuade an AI to ally with humanity? Probably not much (would you ally with mosquitoes or lab rats?). Short of full-on reprogramming or writing a new AI from the ground up (technically possible for the setting), you'd basically need to both a) pick an AI that isn't prioritising extermination, and b) offer it something that it wants for one of its "hobbies".

The most likely AIs to approach are:

• Lucifer: This is presented as a wandering "GM special". It could be anything really.
• Tranquillity: Friendly to humanity, but in hiding.
• Moscow: Humans can and do act as data-collection agents.
• London: Doesn't really care about humans either way. Could conceivably be approached if due caution is taken.
• Washington: The zonemind currently runs a rump USA as a puppet state. With some high-level manoeuvring, this situation could conceivably be inverted, with the USA commandeering the AI as a puppet front when talking to the global AI council.

Yea I'm starting to wrap my head around how dire the situation in the setting is.

What about Zone Caracas? It seems to treat humans like Zone London, but it's hobby is maintaining the environment which leads to more problems with the locals then London's "thinking" does. AI's like Mexico city and Zaire do seem to be ideologically incompatible with Caracas and it may (hopefully) prefer those zones are controlled by humans or perhaps make a deal with the resistance groups that it will gain control over those territories if it backs a human revolt.

Yea, nay or am I completely off base?

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by RogerBW

Er, and Washington with around seven million. (RoS p. 22.)

Arg, I wrote London twice instead of washington!

[RogerBW]

Originally Posted by Minuteman37

Yea I'm starting to wrap my head around how dire the situation in the setting is.

What about Zone Caracas? It seems to treat humans like Zone London, but it's hobby is maintaining the environment which leads to more problems with the locals then London's "thinking" does. AI's like Mexico city and Zaire do seem to be ideologically incompatible with Caracas and it may (hopefully) prefer those zones are controlled by humans or perhaps make a deal with the resistance groups that it will gain control over those territories if it backs a human revolt.

Yea, nay or am I completely off base?

Maybe, but Caracas probably prefers its own goodlife (the aniroids) to the humans that caused the problem in the first place. Remember the AI politics chart, p.50.

[fchase8]

Washington would be the most obvious, since it already uses humans, but the AI would look to run any human side against AIs. Maybe Washington thinks it can exploit a human organization like Human Liberation Army or VIRUS, and take over whatever territory the humans liberate from another AI (mostly likely Denver).

London's another choice, but it seems particularly unaggressive, towards AIs and humans. But if it needed something found in zones Paris or Berlin (for instance, communication with aliens), perhaps it could ally with humans to attack another AI, with the agreement that London gets select areas, the rest are left to humanity.

Moscow could try to ally/use humans in the Siberian War with Vancouver, though the territory fought over is not very human-habitable. But perhaps Moscow provides covert aid to the HLA in Vancouver North America, to weaken its enemy.

Tel Aviv could use 'holy fighters' in conflict with another AI, particularly Zaire (that name is now out-of-date - should it be Kinshasa? Congo?). But they would be completely exploited, not allies. Maybe Tel Aviv inspires a holy rebellion in the Islamic parts of New Delhi (i.e., Pakistan, on the Tel Aviv-New Delhi border), to create a puppet human buffer state.

Caracas, New Delhi, and Brisbane all do experiments on humanity. If one could create a way of turning ordinary humans into powerful weapons, the AI could ally with super-humans to defeat another AI(s), like Caracas invading Mexico City, New Dehli or Brisbane against Overmind.

Maybe Orbital/Luna has contacted powerful aliens, biological aliens, who don't like computer rule over Earth's biological inhabitants, so Orbital/Luna says to the aliens that they're the 'good AI', and will work with the aliens & humans to liberate the ground.

[fredtheobviouspseudonym]

"In the end there can be only one . . . "

Remember that as sentient computers these machines are not sentimental, emotional, or impulsive; logic is likely to be their main characteristic.

Humans, as noted, are merely annoying insects after the Last Big War.

The other zoneminds, however, are potential killers. The assumption (a reasonably likely one) is that only another AI has the brains & resources to be a real threat to a zonemind.

Slip a virus into your target, send in reprogramming bots once the main AI is down, and your power & resources can double. So there is the temptation. Since the other AIs are also amoral and logical, they have a great temptation to kill you & take your stuff.

Sounds like a setting for serious paranoia. (Reference to the West End Games production is deliberate.)

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by fredtheobviouspseudonym

Slip a virus into your target, send in reprogramming bots once the main AI is down, and your power & resources can double. So there is the temptation. Since the other AIs are also amoral and logical, they have a great temptation to kill you & take your stuff.

In our Zone London campaign, Zone Zaire (or something masquerading as it) was trying just this scheme on Zone London. The human PCs decided to stop the operation, since ZZ is much worse than ZL, and told Zone London afterwards what we'd done (it taps all communication cables). It didn't try to kill us, so we presumed it wasn't unhappy.