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Old 05-16-2009, 03:03 PM   #1
Unwitting Pawn
 
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Default raw metals cost

I'm trying to work out reasonable costs for metals by the pound, for a TL2-TL3 fantasy campaign (as ingots, or whatever would be appropriate).

Searching the forum, I found a thread on this topic, but the numbers there don't necessarily match with the item prices suggested in the Basic Set.

Now, the Campaigns book suggests $1000/lb for silver and $20,000/lb for gold, which seems fair enough. But how much for 1 lb of copper, bronze, tin, iron or steel?

DF2 suggests $62.50/lb for copper. I'm not sure of this however, as the standard price in Characters is $400 for a Bronze Breastplate of 20 lb and I would expect bronze to be more expensive than just copper, yet $20/lb for armour that presumably is custom-made for the buyer seems cheap in comparison. Is there something I'm missing here?

As for the price of other ingots of elements/alloys, it seems to me that a crowbar is good comparison for iron cost, being a solid metal item. I imagine that it wouldn't need to be highest quality steel, either. However, $20 for 3 lbs of crowbar gives approx $6.7/lb per pound of iron. So, the "raw" metal must cost the smith less than that, surely?
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Old 05-16-2009, 05:34 PM   #2
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Default Re: raw metals cost

This will do you no good whatsoever for many months, but Low Tech will cover this as part of the crafting rules.
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Old 05-16-2009, 06:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: raw metals cost

Thanks for that TBC, but I was hoping for something a little sooner. Are you guessing the timescale of Low Tech, or do you know through involvement?
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:14 PM   #4
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: raw metals cost

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unwitting Pawn
Thanks for that TBC, but I was hoping for something a little sooner. Are you guessing the timescale of Low Tech, or do you know through involvement?
TBC knows. :)

Reading of the call for Playtesters might suggest to you that the playtest for Low Tech has just started.

Now just _how_ long from the start of a playtest to you having the book in your hot little hands is another matter. Months plural is a minimum in my experience.
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Old 05-16-2009, 08:39 PM   #5
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Default Re: raw metals cost

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Brackin
TBC knows. :)

Reading of the call for Playtesters might suggest to you that the playtest for Low Tech has just started.

Now just _how_ long from the start of a playtest to you having the book in your hot little hands is another matter. Months plural is a minimum in my experience.
I've been meaning to ask experienced people, who are not on SJ Games' payroll, about what they'd guess Low-Techs ETA to be.

I mean are we talking 6 months, or 12 months, or 18 months, as a best guess, based on that type of book, measured from the time that playtesting begins?
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Old 05-16-2009, 09:41 PM   #6
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: raw metals cost

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen
I've been meaning to ask experienced people, who are not on SJ Games' payroll, about what they'd guess Low-Techs ETA to be.

I mean are we talking 6 months, or 12 months, or 18 months, as a best guess, based on that type of book, measured from the time that playtesting begins?
Literally 2 months is the record for the WWII corebook and that was a special case to get released on the anniversary of Pearl Harbor.

6 months would still be historically fairly quick but not at all unique.

Or at least it wouldn't be for a 3e book. 4e books seem to take longer.

The last 4e hardcover released was Thaumatology wasn't it? My mailbox seems to show the playtest starting around May of 06 and the book has an 08 copyright.

I hope Low Tech goes more quickly than that and it very well may. I still don't expect it to be truly quick.
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Old 05-16-2009, 10:11 PM   #7
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Default Re: raw metals cost

I don't know if this will help much, but based on some research I did a few months ago, I set metal prices in my TL2 game thus:

Iron - $65/lb
Copper - $300/lb
Bronze - $324/lb
Tin - $360/lb
Brass - $360/lb
Calamine - $480/lb
Silver - $1,200/lb
Gold - $24,000/lb

The ratios are still in tact, but I think the actual dollar values were manipulated slightly for coinage reasons. I'd think that $20,000/lb for gold is about right. The people at SJG are good about not halfassing the details.

It's also worth noting that a typical 25-lb gold bar (liek those recovered from the Atocha) measured approximately 8 1/3" by 3 1/3" x 1 7/8" and would be worth about $600,000 by this measure, assuming the gold was pure. IT is also worth noting that the bars from the Atocha (TL 4 Spanish Galleon) were marked with their purity. So while size, weight, and purity varied from bar to bar, each one contained the same amount of gold, and thus was worth the same amount. I doubt a TL2 society would go to that length, but it was an interesting product of my readin.
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:51 AM   #8
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Default Re: raw metals cost

They didnot have junkyard back then with old metal idem rusting away. Metal was reuse and recycle by being metal down again. In Dark Age Europe they didnot make they own steel they have to import it from the muslim, so steel was worth more than gold on a weight to weight basic, later on they make small amount of steel by placement than 10 pound iron bar into than clay pot with car olate that was redhot and then bury in the ground where the right amount of air
can keep the carolate slowly burning to add cardon to the iron to make it into steel. Then every week for one day he heat up the bar to white hot heat and bang on it with than hammer on than avinal to beat the impurity out of it for 6 mounth to 1 year after it is low steel or hight steel. Tin ore is only found in afew
place that have huge amount of it which is one of the reason that Roman conquest England and wale to get the tin mine.
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Old 05-17-2009, 05:33 AM   #9
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Default Re: raw metals cost

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen
I've been meaning to ask experienced people, who are not on SJ Games' payroll, about what they'd guess Low-Techs ETA to be.

I mean are we talking 6 months, or 12 months, or 18 months, as a best guess, based on that type of book, measured from the time that playtesting begins?
Kromm has stated that on a book like Powers, first draft takes about 25% of the time, and playtest about 10%. Make of it what you want, caveat emptor, objects in mirror may be closer than they appear, etc.
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Old 05-17-2009, 06:17 AM   #10
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Default Re: raw metals cost

There are ingot, rough and scrap prices in Low-Tech 3e. Since the $ value hasn't changed in 4e, they are fully translatable and readily usable. Low-Tech 4e might give more thought through and economically consistent values, but for now I'd use those values over anyone's guess, since they're official.
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