Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-12-2016, 02:15 PM   #1
Anders
 
Anders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Default Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

As has been pointed out in another thread, Banestorm clerics don't really have access to "Holy Powers". Their power is more of a social nature.

So... what if actual Divine powers began manifesting among religious professionals? Let's say that after the year 2 000, people began having their prayers answered in more literal fashion.

Among Christians this could be explained as the world entering the Seventh Day (one day is a thousand years, and the world was created 4 000 BC.) So the six days of creation are now over, and we are entering the Lord's Day. I'm sure someone sufficiently versed in Islamic lore can cook up some similar goobledy**** to explain things. Of course, it doesn't have to be true.

What effects would this have on the churches and realms of Yrth?
__________________
“When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive, to think, to enjoy, to love ...” Marcus Aurelius
Anders is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2016, 02:34 PM   #2
Kuroshima
MIB
Pyramid Contributor
Mad Spaniard Rules Lawyer
 
Kuroshima's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: The ASS of the world, mainly Valencia, Spain (Europe)
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Well, I'm not a member of the faith (any faith, not just abrahamic ones), nor a sociologist or anthropologist, but if I ran this, here's some of the things I would do
  • The established church hierarchies (specially where they're deeply entwined in the state) would condemn the new miracle-workers as heretics, and probably accuse them of making deals with the devil
  • Less organized religious groups (isolated communities, both secular and monastic) would probably treat the new miracle workers as either new saints, or look down at them in a way that mirrors the organized church
__________________
Antoni Ten
MIB3119
My GURPs character sheet
My stuff on e23
Kuroshima is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2016, 02:40 PM   #3
ericthered
Hero of Democracy
 
ericthered's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: far from the ocean
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

are the powers manifesting among the professionals or the laity? Who gets more: the village priests, the monasteries, or the high ranking bishops? if it manifests among the laity as well, does outward piety or inward sincerity make a difference? These all make BIG differences in the reaction of the church.
__________________
Be helpful, not pedantic

Worlds Beyond Earth -- my blog

Check out the PbP forum! If you don't see a game you'd like, ask me about making one!
ericthered is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2016, 03:11 PM   #4
Anders
 
Anders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

I'm thinking it scales with inward sincerity. This may be very unnerving to the hierarchy.
__________________
“When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive, to think, to enjoy, to love ...” Marcus Aurelius
Anders is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2016, 04:52 PM   #5
martinl
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders View Post
I'm thinking it scales with inward sincerity. This may be very unnerving to the hierarchy.
The hierarchy is unlikely to accept the divine providence of powers that manifest strongly in nobodies and rarely in high church functionaries, especially when they manifest for various folks from other religions.

Be very very careful inserting explicit divine intervention into a setting using real world religions. It is ... fraught, even if your players claim to be cool with it.
martinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2016, 09:31 AM   #6
evileeyore
Banned
 
evileeyore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroshima View Post
  • The established church hierarchies (specially where they're deeply entwined in the state) would condemn the new miracle-workers as heretics, and probably accuse them of making deals with the devil
  • Less organized religious groups (isolated communities, both secular and monastic) would probably treat the new miracle workers as either new saints, or look down at them in a way that mirrors the organized church
Unless those powers also began showing up in higher ranking (even bishop or church father levels).

Or they thought they could control those with the touch of divinity within them. Never underestimate the power-hungry.
evileeyore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2016, 09:33 AM   #7
Anders
 
Anders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Quote:
Originally Posted by martinl View Post
Be very very careful inserting explicit divine intervention into a setting using real world religions. It is ... fraught, even if your players claim to be cool with it.
Challenge accepted.
__________________
“When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive, to think, to enjoy, to love ...” Marcus Aurelius
Anders is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2016, 12:01 PM   #8
malloyd
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders View Post
I'm thinking it scales with inward sincerity. This may be very unnerving to the hierarchy.
How would they know? Inward sincerity is invisible.

This is often a problem with the discussions of this sort of thing, people discuss the consequences as everybody knew details that they can't possibly determine.

A new sort of magic shows up. Is it divine favor?

The people who can do it say so? Well, that's convincing isn't it. Nobody is ever wrong about God being on their side.

People who aren't even members of our faith can do it? That seals it, it is definitely not. Must be something else. Maybe God is OK with it, maybe it's the work of demons, maybe it really even comes from God but he has decided to grant it for something other than being obedient to him for inscrutable godly reasons - after all being alive is a gift of god too right, and he gives that to heretics and Satan worshippers....
__________________
--
MA Lloyd
malloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2016, 01:04 PM   #9
Anders
 
Anders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

This goes back all the way to the Republic and the discussion between Socrates and Glaucon about whether it's better to be good or seem good.

It's important to realize that beliefs influence actions - this is why it's important what people believe. I'm not a Christian, but I would imagine that a Christian would answer this thusly:

a) a sincere Christian would behave in a certain way and if divine favor only comes to (some) people who behave in a Christ-like manner then that points to it being given by the guy above and not the guy below

b) more specifically, Paul tells us "that the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control." A person who behaves and exemplifies these virtues is probably sincere. They may, theoretically, be someone who tortures innocent animals when no one is watching, but that's unlikely.
__________________
“When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive, to think, to enjoy, to love ...” Marcus Aurelius
Anders is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2016, 05:42 PM   #10
Bruno
 
Bruno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Default Re: Adding Divine Favor to Banestorm

Quote:
Originally Posted by malloyd View Post
How would they know? Inward sincerity is invisible.
This is a setting with mind-reading (and controlling) magic. It may be invisible, but it's not indetectable.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table
A Wiki for my F2F Group
A neglected GURPS blog
Bruno is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
banestorm, divine favor

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.