02-17-2018, 06:52 PM | #11 |
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
Briefly wandering away from the topic, I used Trailblazer with good success as an economic system for Starfire.
(Or perhaps the other way around; you could say I used Starfire as a combat system for Trailblazer, so you could finally keep those annoying other players away from your rich planets -- unless, of course, they were motivated enough to build their own warships.) So that system does have some flexibility for adapting to other games. Meanwhile, back in the TFT discussion... |
02-17-2018, 11:41 PM | #12 |
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
Perhaps it would be nice to have a general guideline for creating a job.
A dodgy example: Ragnar says he would like to get a job as a Viking raider. The GM and player discuss it and agree the job will be dangerous (14+), educational (5-), that the character must supply their own equipment, and that it will require Shield, at least three other IQ points worth of weapon talents and Seamanship. Obviously he can only get this job in a place Vikings live, or at least visit. By some magic formula they conclude this job fits the guidelines and will pay $145 a week. This isn't a great example because it's probably handled well enough by other jobs but you get the idea. I've always thought the entry-level wizard job could distinguish between Assistant (gets money, slower experience) and Apprentice (practically no money, faster experience). Another application would be creating jobs like "Sword-fighting student" that pay negative, rather than a separate rule for study or practice. |
02-18-2018, 12:03 AM | #13 | |
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
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For TFT purposes, I did simplify it a bit (when it comes to supply and demand, especially) since the primary purpose of the game was fantasy adventure, not mercantilism... |
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02-18-2018, 12:05 AM | #14 | |
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
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02-18-2018, 09:48 AM | #15 | |
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
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I also prepared a list of different risks/rewards where the attribute gain or the damage was just one of the possible events. Also I created complex rules for finding a job, mantaining it, and re-employ once the PCs left the job. I also created detailed rules for trials, jails, punishments... As I mentioned above I also reduced the rate of the risks allowing a dice roll once a month. I was satisfacted with these house rules at that time. But now I believe things should and could be kept more simple. For example I think we need less jobs, easy to learn rules for IQ rolls to find the job and mantain it when at risk. The GM should adjust the odds/pays and be flexible when things are harder (for example it's impossible gain many $ working as master armourer in a small pacific village where everyone is farmer or a fisher). No reason to create too elaborate rules when the system is flexible and GM/players have common sense. The test 3/IQ once a month basically works pretty well. But it could be 4/IQ or 5/IQ if it's a job hard to find given the circumstances. For a self-employer things are not so much different since also a petty thief must find an agreement with the local Guild to start his "job" and avoid problems. But the most important thing is that jobs during a RPG like TFT should never take the place of the adventures and nobody should say: "well, I'll work for six months and then I'll buy that nice warhorse!" Jobs are mostly for substistance in a hard fantasy world, as an excuse to find a plot for an adventure, and as filler during adventures when a PC is temporarily unavailable. I understand who says that players like complex worlds and a pre-created rule for any situation, but TFT is not exactly a simulation of a Fantasy world and (IMHO) all we need is a solid set uf basic rules allowing everyone to move from it if someone wants to shape the universe in detail. Steve, please give us the basic (updated) tools, we'll build our worlds! |
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02-18-2018, 10:22 AM | #16 |
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
I don't disagree that things should be simplified from what I used. Using it was eye-opening, but I'm equally sure there is a better way to do it than what I did.
And I also agree that the jobs/downtime rolls should never be a substitute for actual roleplaying. We used them to set up situations, and to cover time spent waiting for other party members to heal. The players had a blast with them, and "fun" is, after all the main point. If some character is going to insist on sitting in a job for six months to buy a warhorse, instead of going out adventuring for that same goal, I submit to you that the character has actually said "I'm retiring to a nice safe place," and should be replaced with a new character... On the other hand, a nice macro-economic system, preferably something modular that can be used or ignored, and something simple that doesn't take more than 10 or 15 minutes for the GM to run at home (NOT around the table) would be a nice touch. It would go a long way to creating a local economy with some logic behind it as opposed to the more normal GM hand-wave that falls apart fairly quickly (Guilty!) when confronted with even a basic player question about certain prices, availability of certain items, where the local trade caravans go, and so on... |
02-18-2018, 11:45 AM | #17 | |||
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
What does it help to list fewer jobs?
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The main issues I see are having someone (not named Steve, heh) review the numbers and odds, and fixing the "you get enough experience to grain an attribute, no matter how much that is" problem, and the generic damage consequence - which could just be one or two sentences saying to give 100 EP, and/or have the GM invent an appropriate challenging job situation, and play it out at whatever level of detail seems fun to the GM. |
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02-18-2018, 12:32 PM | #18 | ||
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Arizona
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
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More importantly, I was speaking about my own opinion (as I clearly stated) not making some overarching comment about the "one twue way" to play a game. |
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02-18-2018, 02:53 PM | #19 | |
Join Date: Jan 2018
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
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About the fact players and GM decides how spend time I fully agree. But if the jobs table coming with the rules is too favorable (as it is the current TFT one) we'll have players that spend too much time working to improve their characters attributes through risk rolls and earning an inordinate quantity of money. If the jobs table is not so tempting ( less favorable events, low pays, less savings) we'll hardly have players asking to stay parked too long "to work hard in a safe place". It's called "design for effect". I believe |
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02-18-2018, 10:46 PM | #20 |
Join Date: Dec 2017
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Re: The Economic System in TFT
Chiming in with JLV's post a page or so up, here are the titles of the campaign actions in my notes. Briefly, a campaign turn is 1 week, and you can either perform 1 simple action and move 1/2 your MA, or perform 1 complex action and move 0 or 1 hexes (20 km at Campaign scale). There are also some free actions, and your die roll for your job risk happens, plus a couple of other little details. Anyway, here are is the list you chose from (some have obvious meanings; others you'd have trouble interpreting without my notes):
Simple Actions Adventure: Buy Property Carousing Collect Taxes Duel: Errantry: Gamble: Grant Favor: Loan Money: Perform: Pious Action: Raid: Pay or Collect Ransom: Sell Social Action: Toady Tournament: War Complex Actions Amore Call in Favor: Clear land: Construction Court Spouse: Create artwork Diplomacy Divest Embezzle Enchantment Extort Get Bearings Gladiatorial Contest: Go to Ground Harvest Heist Hunt Invest Join Organization Learn Language Learn Spell Make Contact Medical care Prospect (i.e., find natural resource): Raise investment Reconnoiter Recruit Recuperate Research: Scheme Seek Favor Seek Job: Seek Loan Seek Person Stewardship: Wedding Work farmland Work mine |
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