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Old 06-08-2018, 08:16 PM   #31
roguebfl
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

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Originally Posted by gudmo View Post
I've been reading up on this advantage and keep trying to warap my head around one basic principle.

As this is an "Extra" attack, can it only be used as a followup of normal attack?

i.e. If you Choose to fast draw a potion and quaff it on your normal turn can you use Extra Attack?

Or do you have to use some form of an Attack maneuver on your "normal" turn to trigger an "extra" attack?

The main reason for the question is the use of Move and Attack in contrast with a Move and then Extra Attack

So is it a "legal" action to use a Move maneuver and then use the Extra Attack to attack thereby bypassing all the penalties of a Move and Attack maneuver.
as clarified in the FAQ and Martial Arts, Extra Attack can only be used on Maneuver that already provided an attack. (Attack, Move and Attack, All out attack, and Committed Attack)

Quaffing a Potion is a Ready Maneuver so cant not use Extra attack with it.
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Old 09-26-2020, 05:01 PM   #32
johndallman
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

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Originally Posted by roguebfl View Post
As clarified in the FAQ and Martial Arts, Extra Attack can only be used on a Manoeuvre that already provides an attack. (Attack, Move and Attack, All-Out Attack, and Committed Attack).
Monster Hunters Power-Ups 1 p. 13 now provides Extra Attack (Readying only, +0%) [25], and a +20% enhancement for normal Extra Attack that allows it to be used for readying.
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Old 09-26-2020, 07:25 PM   #33
Plane
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

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Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
Monster Hunters Power-Ups 1 p. 13 now provides Extra Attack (Readying only, +0%) [25], and a +20% enhancement for normal Extra Attack that allows it to be used for readying.
only usable on Attack maneuvers and not Ready maneuvers to get 2 readies, ironically?
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Old 12-28-2020, 10:55 AM   #34
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

In a recent thread, a poster stated that Extra Attack allows you to also take extra steps. My immediate thought was, "No it doesn't!", but then I went back to Characters and it states that "Extra Attack is exactly that: an extra Attack maneuver on your turn in combat."

An Attack maneuver does allow an attack and a step either before or after that attack, so is it accurate that if you have, say, Extra Attack 2, you could take a total of 3 attacks and 3 steps?

I checked the GURPS FAQ, unofficial GURPS FAQ, and of course this thread, and Extra Attacks and steps aren't addressed in any of them. I do note that in DFRPG, the wording on Extra Attack doesn't say you get an extra Attack maneuver, just an extra attack.

So, either I've been doing this wrong for a very long time, or the wording in Characters isn't precisely what is intended. Can anyone clarify?
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Old 12-28-2020, 01:29 PM   #35
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

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Originally Posted by GnomesofZurich View Post
So, either I've been doing this wrong for a very long time, or the wording in Characters isn't precisely what is intended. Can anyone clarify?

I am strongly inclined to think that this is another case where GURPS rules are written on the principle of straightforwardness rather than lawyerly precision.
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Old 12-28-2020, 01:42 PM   #36
JulianLW
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

The GURPS Wiki has a few paragraphs about this:

https://gurps.fandom.com/wiki/Extra_...f%20the%20deal.

Near the bottom of the page, this:

"MA128 has an example (Serena) where in trading attacks for steps, it does not appear to acknowledge her Extra Attack giving her a 2nd step:
Serena has Extra Attack 1, giving her two basic attacks. Taking an Attack maneuver, she converts one into a Rapid Strike for three attacks at -6 apiece (-12, halved for Trained by a Master). She trades the other for a step. With the basic step allowed on an Attack, she gets two steps.
"If Extra Attack 1 gave her 2 attacks + 2 steps then trading just the attack (but not the step) should have given her THREE steps, not two."
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Old 12-29-2020, 12:28 PM   #37
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week (#52): Extra Attack

Quote:
Originally Posted by GnomesofZurich View Post
In a recent thread, a poster stated that Extra Attack allows you to also take extra steps.
My immediate thought was, "No it doesn't!",
but then I went back to Characters and it states that "Extra Attack is exactly that:
an extra Attack maneuver on your turn in combat."
Actually giving an entire new maneuver would be a bigger deal than just the free step, it would also mean resetting the cumulative -4 you suffer for repeat parries, and a new chance to use "once per turn" abilities since each new maneuver is a new turn.

I think the issue with Basic is at the time they wrote Extra Attack, they had not emphasized the discrete concept of "attack action" from "Attack maneuver".

We see that on B43 under Comparmentalized Mind too:
never more than one physical maneuver – for that, see Extra Attack
and also B53 under Extra Arms:
you do not get additional attacks (or other extra maneuvers) in combat unless you buy Extra
Attacks
B54 even does it for the depricated "Feint" maneuver
You may use some of your attacks for Feint maneuvers
That happens with "feint action" v "Feint maneuver" too, when "Feint" basically ceases to become a maneuver on it's own since it can just be done in place of an attack.

"All-Out Attack: Feint" also ceases to functionally exist going from Basic>MA: that's just "All-Out Attack: Double" using a Feint as one of the attacks.

I think this wording is sort of a carryover from 3e where they just forgot to rephrase in 4e terminology, as back then the term "maneuver" was used two ways: the basic use in 4e, but also used to mean what "technique" means in 4e, as 3e's MA42 did with "martial arts maneuvers" and included stuff like active defenses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GnomesofZurich View Post
An Attack maneuver does allow an attack and a step either before or after that attack, so is it accurate that if you have, say, Extra Attack 2, you could take a total of 3 attacks and 3 steps?
You could read Basic that way which is probably why Martial Arts ruled that out, amongst other changes (another being limiting the ability to attack widely spaced foes with Rapid Strike or Extra Attack)
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