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Old 12-14-2019, 10:00 PM   #1
Galfridus
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Bedford, MA
Default Slide maneuver

The slide maneuver seems off to me. Looking at the slide maneuver performed around 7:00 of the Rookie Race video provides a sense of what a slide entails. I can't post attachments for some reason (the site FAQ seems to indicate it's allowed, maybe it's out of date), but here's a link to an image I made on BGG.

https://boardgamegeek.com/image/5109091/galfridus

Looking at that image, the red dashed rectangles show the starting position (lower right) and ending position (upper left) for the slide performed. The red arrow shows the distance moved "forward" (in the direction the car is pointed).

The yellow dashed rectangle shows where a second slide in the opposite direction would put the car (using the yellow arrow to show how far "forward" it would go).

It seems weird that for 2 moves, the car ends up...about 2/3 of a car length forward.
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Old 12-15-2019, 01:41 AM   #2
HeatDeath
 
Join Date: May 2012
Default Re: Slide maneuver

As I wrote in the KS comments:

Quote:
it's important to remember that this /isn't/ a simulation - speed and time and acceleration are being kept deliberately undefined and impressionistic - the better to feel zoomy and boomy and fun.

[Car Wars Classic also bore zero resemblence to the way real cars move too. It may have /felt/ more simulation-y, but it was non-physical and arbitrary too, just in different ways.]

Queens and bishops can't run diagonally across medieval battlefields at 8 times the speed of an infantryman either. :)

Tactically, a good reason for a fairly abrupt slide like that is to avoid hitting something - a goal that would be much more difficult to accomplish using only the graded turns.
By doing it as two maneuvers instead of a hard tire-damaging two-speed-unit speed change, you're trading off a different probability curve of tire-damage vs. control loss, preserving your forward velocity for the next turn by trading on the fact that you have some room beside you. It's an interesting but not apparently unbalanced tradeoff. It''ll be interesting to analyze it more fully.
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Old 12-15-2019, 02:03 AM   #3
JimTullis
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Default Re: Slide maneuver

I think some people have decided to call this maneuver a swerve. Which I think sounds good. Slide seems to be an odd term.

If you did it with a Tesla would it be an "Electric Slide"?
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Old 12-15-2019, 09:32 AM   #4
beetle496
 
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by HeatDeath View Post
By doing it as two maneuvers instead of a hard tire-damaging two-speed-unit speed change, you're trading off a different probability curve…
First, can you even change speed as maneuver? My understanding is that the hard brake opportunity is only at the start of your turn (when you set your speed).

Secondly, trading two D1 maneuvers for a choice that has a 100% chance to cause tire damage seems like a no-brainer.

I think SJG called the maneuver a “slide” because you physically slide the base along the turning key. Labeling the move as a “swerve” is how I will be characterizing it.
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Old 12-16-2019, 09:46 AM   #5
Magesmiley
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by beetle496 View Post
First, can you even change speed as maneuver? My understanding is that the hard brake opportunity is only at the start of your turn (when you set your speed).

Secondly, trading two D1 maneuvers for a choice that has a 100% chance to cause tire damage seems like a no-brainer.

I think SJG called the maneuver a “slide” because you physically slide the base along the turning key. Labeling the move as a “swerve” is how I will be characterizing it.
Unless its changed significantly, speed was set immediately before movement.
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Old 12-16-2019, 01:13 PM   #6
HeatDeath
 
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by Magesmiley View Post
Unless its changed significantly, speed was set immediately before movement.
That's exactly my point. Speed is set at the beginning of movement, and even there you're constrained (less so if you took certain gear or are willing to risk tire or power plant damage).

Slides give you some wiggle room to manipulate your /effective/ speed during your movement, risking control status rather than damage.

It's an interestingly different set of decisions and tradeoffs to make. I like it.
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Old 12-18-2019, 07:23 PM   #7
beetle496
 
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by HeatDeath View Post
]It's an interestingly different set of decisions and tradeoffs to make. I like it.
Well, I like it too, but it does not seem all that interesting, since the swerve is very low risk.
Quote:
Slides give you some wiggle room to manipulate your effective speed during your movement, risking control status rather than damage.
It seems to me that maybe 99% of the time, slowing by 1 followed by a swerve left then a swerve right is clearly a better choice than slowing down by 2. As best I can tell, both have the same end-positioning result. Yet one choice wrecks your tires, and the other gives you two Ace tokens!
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Old 12-18-2019, 11:10 PM   #8
Magesmiley
 
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by beetle496 View Post
Well, I like it too, but it does not seem all that interesting, since the swerve is very low risk.

It seems to me that maybe 99% of the time, slowing by 1 followed by a swerve left then a swerve right is clearly a better choice than slowing down by 2. As best I can tell, both have the same end-positioning result. Yet one choice wrecks your tires, and the other gives you two Ace tokens!
There is also collisions to consider. The slide can be an effective way to get a collision impact on the side you want.
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Old 12-19-2019, 11:14 AM   #9
TheAmishStig
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Lancaster, PA
Default Re: Slide maneuver

I wouldn't call it low risk...going Out of Control at an inopportune time is devastating, especially if your opponent still has a Flame (toasty!) or Shred (tire terrorizer) weapon, since if you're not rolling dice to defend yourself you have no way to counter their special effects.

From my limited experience, which is better comes down to the context of the speeds in question.

At high speeds, especially early-game when you've got Tires to spare, do the hard braking. Chucking 4+ Yellow multiple times chews away the Control Tokens in a hurry, and at high speeds they're already in short supply.

At low speeds, shake what your OEM gave ya. Not only do you have a larger Control Token budget for the turn, you're less likely to lose them from wiggling around (fewer dice thrown for the maneuver)...and the Ace Tokens will come in really useful while being shot at since you won't have a lot of Speed dice to defend with.

And if you plan on doing it a bunch? Spend the points on ABS, or whatever the system is (assuming it wasn't pulled for being too powerful). It's one less offensive goodie on the car, but as long as it's intact you can hard brake to your heart's content.
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Old 12-19-2019, 11:19 AM   #10
Aleph
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Default Re: Slide maneuver

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Originally Posted by beetle496 View Post
Well, I like it too, but it does not seem all that interesting, since the swerve is very low risk.
Nothing is low risk at speed 5. ;)
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