04-09-2018, 09:57 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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trance states in GURPS
One of my players has a character who practices various mystical disciplines in a world where spirits are prevalent and magic is largely animistic. She has the perk Autotrance and the skill Meditation-11; the latter gives her a default of Autohypnosis-7.
What's the relationship between those three traits? Autotrance lets you enter a trance at will by concentrating for 1 minute and making a Will roll. Meditation lets you enter a trance by concentrating for (in her case) 9 seconds, and making a skill roll. Autohypnosis lets you enter a trance by concentrating for (in her case) 13 seconds, and making a skill roll. Each of the three trances seems to have different benefits. Since Autohypnosis and Meditation take comparable amounts of time, it doesn't seem as if either can be a shortcut to the other. Rather, they seem to be alternative applications of related techniques. It's not obvious how they relate to Autotrance. Could a roll against either be substituted for the Will roll, if it was better (not the case with this character, who has Will-13)? Would Autotrance be faster if done with one of the skills, or would the requirement for a full minute still apply? Both Meditation and Autohypnosis grant benefits focused on oneself: finding the answers to moral dilemmas, improving concentration, increasing Will, negating pain/fatigue. None of these seems to involve the spirits. Is the enhanced ability to contact the spirits purely a product of the (perhaps deeper) trance state gained by Autohypnosis? Does the +2 to Will from a roll vs. Autohypnosis-2 (in this case, 5!) raise Will for the purposes of Autotrance (raising it to 15 in this case)? Autotrance gives +2 to attempts to contact spirits. But I'm not clear on how you go about contacting spirits. Is there an advantage that enables this, or a skill? Is that what the bonus applies to? Or is contacting spirits something that just happens in certain places or at certain times? Can Autotrance be learned as a side effect of studying Meditation or Autohypnosis? Or is it purely an inborn susceptibility? Any thoughts on this would be welcome.
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04-10-2018, 03:50 AM | #2 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: trance states in GURPS
These traits are very vague. I wrote up some house rules & notes on their application for a couple of campaigns in which they featured.
I suppose the +2 Autotrance bonus to contacting spirits only applies to the use of the Channeling advantage as written.
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04-10-2018, 07:23 AM | #3 | |||||||
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: trance states in GURPS
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04-10-2018, 08:59 AM | #4 |
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Meifumado
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Re: trance states in GURPS
Flavour-wise, Meditation looks like the Buddhist/Yoga technique, obviously, while Autohypnosis is the Western/Esoteric tradition.
I think Meditation is also supposed to be the more shallow but conscious and aware version, although I don't think that's supported by the rules. Given that, I'd lean toward Autohypnosis being better for contacting spirits. I don't think a Perk should fully replace a Skill, so Autotrance should help enter the hypnotic trance. +2 for skill to calculate time, perhaps? Furthermore, other skills that need trances, Body Control, Metabolism Control, etc, should get the +2. I think there's a contradiction between the text in Channeling and Autotrance though: Channeling - "To do so, you must enter a trance, achieved through one minute of concentration and a Will roll (at +2 if you have Autotrance, p. 101)." Autotrance - "This trance gives +2 on rolls to contact spirits, etc." They could be read as saying the same thing, but the wording on Autotrance seems like the +2 applies to a Reaction Roll or Summoning Roll of some sort. Furthermore, the Channeling text still requires the Will roll to enter the trance with Autotrance, while under the Autotrance text it's automatic. Searching, this thread doesn't quite answer any questions, and neither does the Skill of the Week thread.
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04-10-2018, 09:24 AM | #5 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: trance states in GURPS
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I agree that Autotrance produces a deeper trance state than the two skills. Its being a perk rather than a skill seems to be balanced if that deeper state is one that's ONLY useful for contacting spirits, not for the relatively mundane benefits granted by the skills.
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04-10-2018, 10:34 AM | #6 | |
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Meifumado
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Re: trance states in GURPS
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According to a New Scientist article I half-remember from years ago, there are two types of meditation, inner and outer, and they linked them to the perception of stimuli, such as a bell ringing. Normally, when you perceive a new stimulus, such as a bell ringing, you pay strong attention to it. When the ringing continues, your attention attenuates and perhaps fades into the background. You could plot this as a graph with gradually diminishing spikes. Roughly, an outer trance state meditator focuses on their perceptions of their environment. They become acutely aware of everything around them, the feel of each floor board they're sitting on, the movement of air against different patches of skin, and such. Their attention graph to the bell ringing shows spikes of constant amplitude- each peal is perceived as though it were the first. In contrast, an inner state trance meditator focuses on their own mental processes and blanks out everything around them. Their response graph to the bell is constantly muted. This describes people being "in the zone" when they're writing or painting, if they're in a fugue state, and such. I would postulate a third, higher state trance, when you push beyond your own mental processes and become aware of so-called higher levels of consciousness. This is where you can astral travel, project, possess people, activate psychic skills or communicate with ghosts, spirits and other trans-dimensional beings. Drugs such as LSD or DHT supposedly aid this state. Not all GURPS skills and effects will exactly map to these, but roughly: The outer state trance is accessed by Meditation, and is used for Zen Archery and Blind Fighting. The inner state trance is accessed by Autohypnosis, and gives the stated bonuses for tasks requiring focused concentration. Possibly Body/Metabolism Control is governed by an inner state trance. Autotrance might do well to be renamed then, or split up. My suggestion: Easy Trance- you get a +2 to any skill roll to enter any form of trance state. High Trance- you can achieve a strong separation between your astral being and your physical/mental being. +2 for contacting spirits, etc, but also possibly for astral travel and similar skills. (Oops... what does GURPS Psionic Powers do along these lines?) Otherwise, I might say that reaching a high state trance first requires gaining an inner state, then a second roll to move on from there.
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04-10-2018, 10:47 AM | #7 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: trance states in GURPS
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04-11-2018, 03:00 AM | #8 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: trance states in GURPS
That sounds like a pretty impressive ability for a perk. But maybe it's not such a big deal in your campaign? I recall Autotrance was worth 5 points in 3rd edition.
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04-11-2018, 03:48 AM | #9 |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: trance states in GURPS
Well, I hadn't pinned it down that that was a result of Autotrance. She also has Meditation-11, and I think I may have been having her roll vs. that. It's becoming more important to figure out exactly how it's happening, though.
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autohypnosis, autotrance |
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