Elven Poltics

[roguebfl]

Granting the assumptions that the elves we're talking about have longevity that effectively Unaging once they finish their 100 year adolescence, and due to their magic they economically live in effectively post scarcity prestige economy.

I was consider ennui be a one of the intractable issues that divide their politics which the major divisions would mastering a skill vers dabbling in many. What do you see the political system evolving out of this situation?

[Apollonian]

Originally Posted by roguebfl

Granting the assumptions that the elves we're talking about have longevity that effectively Unaging once they finish their 100 year adolescence, and due to their magic they economically live in effectively post scarcity prestige economy.

I was consider ennui be a one of the intractable issues that divide their politics which the major divisions would mastering a skill vers dabbling in many. What do you see the political system evolving out of this situation?

Ennui and post-scarcity prestige economy are internal factors. What are the external factors affecting this elven society?

[ericthered]

You've mentioned a potential difference between specialists and generalists. This has a lot of cultural value.

• Generalists will kind of all form one community that talks with itself a lot.
• Specialists will not be able to band together as a whole, but will know people in their chosen specialization extremely well.
• Specialists will likely be in charge/the best at any given endeavor, But at any given moment, one or more groups will be struggling to find work.
• Generalists will see specialists as arrogant and stubborn, and accuse them of seeking to rule and being complainers when things don't go their way
• Specialists will see generalists as quitters and feeble-minded, and may also characterize them as being lazy or short sighted.
• Generalist and Specialist are probably a continuum, and elves find themselves on a spectrum.

You haven't mentioned the government type, and that will effect these things a lot.

[roguebfl]

Originally Posted by ericthered

You've mentioned a potential difference between specialists and generalists. This has a lot of cultural value.

• Generalists will kind of all form one community that talks with itself a lot.
• Specialists will not be able to band together as a whole, but will know people in their chosen specialization extremely well.
• Specialists will likely be in charge/the best at any given endeavor, But at any given moment, one or more groups will be struggling to find work.
• Generalists will see specialists as arrogant and stubborn, and accuse them of seeking to rule and being complainers when things don't go their way
• Specialists will see generalists as quitters and feeble-minded, and may also characterize them as being lazy or short sighted.
• Generalist and Specialist are probably a continuum, and elves find themselves on a spectrum.

The short sighted accusation probably goes both ways as Generalist will Specialist suffering from tunnel vision and trouble see the big picture.

You haven't mentioned the government type, and that will effect these things a lot.

That because that one primary things I want to discuss what would be something that evolves to match that culture 8)

[Stormcrow]

It really depends on too many factors. But in general, any government of immortal elves will be as unchanging as they are. If we assume a generally good chance of continued life — that is, no constant wars to roil the population — then you would either have the government be static, or you would have constantly rotating positions. In the former case, if there's a king then the king will always be the king, etc., so there's no Game of Thrones-style court intrigue. Elves' ambitions would not tend toward the acquisition of limited resources like political power, because there's only so much of it to go around and those who have it can be expected to keep it forever.

If there are no fixed political positions, then I'd expect a very democratic, egalitarian society. No one expects to keep their position for very long, because there's no such thing as "very long" to immortal elves. And if you can't expect to keep political power for much time, it's not much of a draw to you to abuse it. So elves would just consider it a civic duty and do it. And everyone would do it, because eventually every elf will have had opportunities to serve.

So it depends greatly on what kind of society you're dealing with. A more interesting exercise might be to posit a society of elves, and then figure out what immortality would mean to that society.

[roguebfl]

Originally Posted by Apollonian

Ennui and post-scarcity prestige economy are internal factors. What are the external factors affecting this elven society?

Somewhat stable.their eastern and north borders are Mountains which only one major pass not far outside their North western borders. To surface of the Mountains is Controlled Gnomes and under by Dwarves, though occasional Orcs, Goblin, Kobolds and Drow raiders make though minor passes/underdark (the Drow is considered the Major threat no just because the other more easily stopped by the Gnomes, but because Drow were a warped "offshoot" of elves (Action of two evil gods who cannot create their own from scratch) as well as undark entrances are closer.

The Western border is a Human kingdom with a minority Halfling population (mostly made of wandering traders)

The Southern border is Bay control by Antro-Penguins who pirate most fishing.

That Major mount Pass is technicly in Human lands, but the Humans, Elves and Dwarves have a Mutual alliance the Guard the Pass, to the North of Pass is the "Warped lands" which has no government more powerful than a city state , before you get to the Orc empire.

[Apollonian]

Originally Posted by roguebfl

Somewhat stable.their eastern and north borders are Mountains which only one major pass not far outside their North western borders. To surface of the Mountains is Controlled Gnomes and under by Dwarves, though occasional Orcs, Goblin, Kobolds and Drow raiders make though minor passes/underdark (the Drow is considered the Major threat no just because the other more easily stopped by the Gnomes, but because Drow were a warped "offshoot" of elves (Action of two evil gods who cannot create their own from scratch) as well as undark entrances are closer.

The Western border is a Human kingdom with a minority Halfling population (mostly made of wandering traders)

The Southern border is Bay control by Antro-Penguins who pirate most fishing.

That Major mount Pass is technically in Human lands, but the Humans, Elves and Dwarves have a Mutual alliance the Guard the Pass, to the North of Pass is the "Warped lands" which has no government more powerful than a city state , before you get to the Orc empire.

Okay, but what pressures does this put elven society to which it reacts?

Other questions:
How old, really, is this society? How many children have been born to the founders and had children of their own? Is a generation even meaningful to them?

How old it is lets you know how many crises they have endured and what a new one might look like. ("Another dwarf civil war? Break out ol' plan 236 B, it worked the last five times.") The more experience they have, they less they have to find new solutions... or at least feel they have to. Maybe they have an innate love of novelty.

How big is this society? How many elves, and spread out over how much land? The forms of organization needed for a few hundred elves spread out over the continent-spanning Great Forest are going to be different from that required for the ten thousand elves packed into the City of Timeless Light and its small hinterlands behind the Wall.

How quickly do they communicate? If the King can send a message to the entire kingdom in the space of a day, it's going to be quite different from a culture where news of happenings on the border take several years to reach the center(s) of power.

[roguebfl]

I had original invision being more generic, but Sure I'll give you more detail of reference world i was going apply the results to.

Originally Posted by Apollonian

Okay, but what pressures does this put elven society to which it reacts?

Well Raids from Drow and other monster attacks means the forests need to be patrolled, plus maintain their Share to man the Shieldwall Fortress at the Pass against an Orcish army.

The humans to west is ruled by a Queen-priestess of the Goddess of Protection (who trace their lineage to a Demigod Daughter of that god) so no partially expansionist, but have a loose alliances with a couple of attempts to found city states north of the pass, that might become Duchies of the turn out to be viable.

There will of course how to interact with Halfling traders.

Their southern bay border transitioning into a Mangrove swamp so Sea is really open to them.

Other questions:
How old, really, is this society? How many children have been born to the founders and had children of their own? Is a generation even meaningful to them?

How old it is lets you know how many crises they have endured and what a new one might look like. ("Another dwarf civil war? Break out ol' plan 236 B, it worked the last five times.") The more experience they have, they less they have to find new solutions... or at least feel they have to. Maybe they have an innate love of novelty.

The probably been around since the Rebellion against Dragons, when the Gods revealed themselves to Mortals (including the Goddess of Magic teaching the first Mage) I've not decide whether then any elves who remember these times first hand still around, but if there are any there not many.

with a low birth rate, they probably don't have big generational divide bans beyond the basic Energetic Youth and Mature.

After age of Growth where Elves, Dwarves, Humans, Gnomes and Halfling Explored and spread out. The God of Hatred provoked the god of (Destructive) Chaos that he could not create a races of followers for himself, cause a Cataclysm that not own reshaped the land is also Cause some elves to birth the first Drow (Drewgar, Orcs, Kolbolds and Goblins came from simal warping of the other races) as well as create Antro released (the Warped ones) out of animals. But Shieldwall mounts were sacred to the Goddess of protect and the land cradled be the mounds and the Bay were speared most of the ravages, but any kingdoms outside were lost contact with. Hand to deal with what ended up the expulsion of the drow into the underdark, as they were made a warped parody of Elves who are predominately selfish sadistic bullies. But each of the neighbors had to deal with similar troubles

Since then there was a Human Sorcerer (Sorcery innate Magic that comes from having Dragonblood) Turned Lich and developed necromantic spell that could could actually destroy a soul. This is a setting works on reincarnation so this set the Human kingdom on a holy war against the Lich and Arcane Necromancy in general.

How big is this society? How many elves, and spread out over how much land? The forms of organization needed for a few hundred elves spread out over the continent-spanning Great Forest are going to be different from that required for the ten thousand elves packed into the City of Timeless Light and its small hinterlands behind the Wall.

I handed designed an exact size, but I was probably invitation about the size of a large european country, but not with human level population density due to their in balance with nature aesthetic.

How quickly do they communicate? If the King can send a message to the entire kingdom in the space of a day, it's going to be quite different from a culture where news of happenings on the border take several years to reach the center(s) of power.

They have Magic but don't think I want a magical mass communication after all lack of such rapid commission creatures the window in indepence the allows for adventures.

[Luke Bunyip]

Is there any separation of powers? Ceremonial / theological roles, such as the Roman Aediles, or admistrative or judicial roles, like those of the Tribunes?

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by roguebfl

Granting the assumptions that the elves we're talking about have longevity that effectively Unaging once they finish their 100 year adolescence, and due to their magic they economically live in effectively post scarcity prestige economy.

I was consider ennui be a one of the intractable issues that divide their politics which the major divisions would mastering a skill vers dabbling in many. What do you see the political system evolving out of this situation?

I once did a version of elves for D&D based on their being majority Chaotic Good and vastly long lived. So my version had "kings" who didn't pass on their position to the offspring and just abdicated when they realized they had lost the respect of the people in favour of someone who was more respected. It was unofficial democracy.