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Old 07-12-2018, 02:09 PM   #41
Tomsdad
 
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
When I am talking about social and economic realism, I am generally talking about people who have realistic social and economic responses to the events in the campaign. For an example of social realism, everyone has their own complex motivations that underlie their actions (even if they do not realize that they have those motivations), so villains should have a reason for their villainy other than just being evil and heroes should have a reason for their heroics other than just being good (and the plans of villains should logically reflect their reasons for villainy and the methods of heroes should logically reflect their reasons for heroism). For an example of economic realism, societies where wizards are capable of generating high quality light for cheap will not hunt whales for lantern oil and societies where anyone is capable of contributing to ceremonial magic should not have widespread poverty (as the availability of magical energy allows for massive gains it economic productivity and the ability of anyone to contribute to ceremonial magic should allow for a baseline Struggling income).
OK got you, yeah i know what you mean. But I guess I can ignore social & economic realism just as I can ignore other types of realism if required. That said the games I run tend not to.
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Old 07-12-2018, 03:28 PM   #42
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

I once said during an Asperger rant in a game shop that "if this is true (I dropped and object from shoulder height) then you have to take into account a ton of other things" This was close to 20 years ago and I've grown as a gamer and a person from that time and as a friend of my pointed out "I don't think anyone is interested in Physics the Roleplaying game".
I'll say that there are people out there looking for "Physics the RPG" and there is nothing wrong with that, but what I realized is that I was "weaponizing" realism in that rant to be used against a GM.
Realism should be something the table comes to as an agreement and as friends, it shouldn't be something that is used as a weapon in an argument. If it is then you're argument is pretty weak as this is all make believe and based on rules agreed upon by everyone before hand and by using it, you just seem to be grasping at straws to get your way.
"You" and "your" aren't meant to target anyone here but just to illustrate my point.
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Old 07-12-2018, 05:44 PM   #43
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

It's intuitively obvious that you have to make some kind of compromise with 'realism' when you run an RPG because no system, not even GURPS, is a precise model of the real world...and nor should it be.

Some level of verisimilitude or at least internal consistency is important in in most campaigns I think, because without that you get immersion-breaking moments.

How far down the rabbit hole you want to go when you create your setting is a personal choice. I scarcely bother because I tend to run kitchen-sink fantasy ported over from D&D, and the setting is pretty much a hot mess. I don't have the time or the inclination to 'fix' it. I respect for people who do create internally consistent fantasy worlds though, it's something I find overwhelming to consider doing.

What I do try to avoid is using 'realism' as an excuse to promote some kind of agenda. I'm pretty comfortable with the idea that the settings I use are 'unrealistically' tolerant towards women having their own opinions for example. Or that stable, centralised nation states exist, at the other end of the scale.
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Old 07-12-2018, 06:38 PM   #44
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

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It's intuitively obvious that you have to make some kind of compromise with 'realism' when you run an RPG because no system, not even GURPS, is a precise model of the real world...and nor should it be.
That's why the artistic movement is called "realism." It's about creating works of art that give the impression of reality. If you want more than that you use a camera, not a paintbrush.
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Old 07-12-2018, 07:13 PM   #45
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

Sometimes attempting verisimilitude kills itself if you go overboard. One of my problems with Yrth (otherwise a quite likable production) is that the magic is to mundane. When you have magical elevators in hotels it takes the point away. Tolkienite magic is strange and, magical and paradoxically is easier to believe for that reason.
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Old 07-12-2018, 10:28 PM   #46
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

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I take umbrage at the notion that a utopian socialism like Star Trek is economically or socially unrealistic... (it hurts my idealistically utopian communist soul)

C-Punk is close enough to 'real' I don't even need to do any work.

I agree that Soaps and Supes are completely 'unrealistic'. The suspenders get a lot of work.
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Originally Posted by jason taylor View Post
Sometimes attempting verisimilitude kills itself if you go overboard. One of my problems with Yrth (otherwise a quite likable production) is that the magic is to mundane. When you have magical elevators in hotels it takes the point away. Tolkienite magic is strange and, magical and paradoxically is easier to believe for that reason.
I agree.

Yrth never really worked for me as a setting. The best game mechanical treatment of magic is mage the ascension. Gurps did a good job of preserving the concepts for the licensed version.
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Old 07-12-2018, 11:52 PM   #47
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: What do we mean by "Realistic"?

Yrth had many problems. Strangely enough, one of the big ones would have been easily solved by a single addition to the spell list. An Ignite Propellant spell with an area effect and a cost of 1/10 per yard (minimum 1) would have given a logical reason for firearms not existing (a ceremonial casting could potentially ignite every propellant within 1000 yards). Other solutions would have been to allow magic to change the economy like it realistically would have with the distribution that existed in Yrth.
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