[Powers] Large-scale only weather worker?

[ericthered]

Yes, this is related to this thread here. But I'd like to focus in on just part of it.

The ability I need has the following:

• can cause or stop rain, fog, or wind that could naturally happen in an area at a given time
• makes such things happen on a natural scale, taking from 1 minute (for making heavy rain laden cloulds), to a few hours (for a freak rain storm in the sahara)
• mechanically indistinguishable from normal weather.
• Manipulation of the effect is limited to large scale shaping: wind direction is doable. Raining on half a city is doable -- though the other half will see heavy clouds. raining on a single house is not.
• Duration related to either concentration or the natural life of the weather form
• Low Point cost is eminently prefferable (Multiplicative modifiers are in play)
• RAW is strongly prefferred, as is minimizing hand waving.

Help me understand the west way to make a weather ability that's strategic level only, and make it affordable!

Note: this Kromm post rules out simply using control(natural phenomenon). This ability doesn't pull stunts like having a beam of good light around you in the middle of the storm, and it shouldn't cost the same as an ability that allows those stunts

[naloth]

I'd take a stab at it, but it's easier if you the game effect your going for rather than the form it takes.

Cause rain/fog/wind sound like Obscure of various types since it would give penalties to sight, hearing, or trying to do things. Severe winds are more like an innate attack (knock back) or area TK. Nasty weather (lightning, hail) are just variant Innate Attacks with overhead, bombardment, and a large area.

Stopping fog, wind, rain is a bit of a trick, but you can grant the advantages Sure Footing, Alertness, Resistance to counter various weather penalties.

Having things take time is just one or more limitations (probably Environmental -20% and extra time)

Concentration would be required for most abilities that did not have duration, though you could buy a duration.

Using MM and alternate abilities, I doubt most of the abilities would be that expensive.

[Celti]

I have a weather-worker character — not low-value by any stretch, though — that I statted up with: Control Weather 3 (Cosmic, can affect wider weather patterns, +300%; Cumulative, +400%; Extended Duration, until the seasons turn, +150%; Natural Phenomena, +100%; Persistent, +40%; Onset, 1 minute, -10%; Elemental, -10%; Super, -10%) [524], and then turned into a Wildcard power.

You could do something similar to what you want, I think, with just playing around with that Cosmic, Cumulative, and Onset — Cumulative isn't strictly RAW-legal on Control but my GM liked the way that worked too much to forbid it.

Try Control Weather 1 (Cosmic, can affect wider weather patterns, +300%; Cumulative, +400%; Natural Phenomena, +100%; Onset, 1 hour, -20%; Elemental, -10%; PM, -10%) [108]. This should let you concentrate to enact a weather change that takes three hours per ±1 to form, and can influence wider weather patterns with a successful Meteorology roll at whatever penalties the GM wishes to apply. You can, long-term, adjust strategic weather patterns over an area at penalties enforced by the GM but you're limited to painfully long times to change the weather over your strictly limited 200-yard radius.

[Lia Valenth]

I would agree with naloth in general, but like they said there really is no way to lighten bad weather conditions. At least none I can think of.

Originally Posted by Celti

...
Try Control Weather 1 (Cosmic, can affect wider weather patterns, +300%; Cumulative, +400%; Natural Phenomena, +100%; Onset, 1 hour, -20%; Elemental, -10%; PM, -10%) [108]. This should let you concentrate to enact a weather change that takes three hours per ±1 to form, and can influence wider weather patterns with a successful Meteorology roll at whatever penalties the GM wishes to apply. You can, long-term, adjust strategic weather patterns over an area at penalties enforced by the GM but you're limited to painfully long times to change the weather over your strictly limited 200-yard radius.

This is actually one of the most elegant solutions I have seen. Personally, I would say you need Nonselective, -20% as suggested in the other thread (changing the total cost to [72]). If the GM agrees, I would think it would work for what you want.

[Refplace]

I thought about this in the other thread but it didn't seem to be what the Op wanted.
Split the difference for a new Enhancement between Natural Phenomena and Cosmetic.
So Background Phenomena +50%
You can use your control over a wide area but its limited to subtle or what could be considered natural effects and changes.

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by naloth

Cause rain/fog/wind sound like Obscure of various types since it would give penalties to sight, hearing, or trying to do things.

Ok, creative use of obscure --- I'd thought of it for fog, but sound is good and I'm wondering now if it can be legitimately used creatively for other 'senses'.

Severe winds are more like an innate attack (knock back) or area TK. Nasty weather (lightning, hail) are just variant Innate Attacks with overhead, bombardment, and a large area.

Figured. Fairly easy and frighteningly cheap (most wind doesn't do more than 1 damage in knock-back)

Stopping fog, wind, rain is a bit of a trick, but you can grant the advantages Sure Footing, Alertness, Resistance to counter various weather penalties.

That's were things get hand wavy. Area effect Resistance to weather sounds really funny and I can't decide if its a fantastically creative idea or a terrible idea.

Having things take time is just one or more limitations (probably Environmental -20% and extra time)

Environmental is a fairly solid suggestion. Thanks for pointing that out.

This way to do it mainly has the problem that it doesn't extend well-- meaning I need an entirely new set of abilities for oceans, avalanches, crops, and kingdom prosperity. And its really messy. But it does what I asked for.

Originally Posted by Celti

You could do something similar to what you want, I think, with just playing around with that Cosmic, Cumulative, and Onset — Cumulative isn't strictly RAW-legal on Control but my GM liked the way that worked too much to forbid it.

Cumulative is a very interesting idea -- it give inertia to the work the weather worker does, but prevents him from turning on a dime. you've got a good point about RAW though.

Originally Posted by Refplace

I thought about this in the other thread but it didn't seem to be what the Op wanted.
Split the difference for a new Enhancement between Natural Phenomena and Cosmetic.
So Background Phenomena +50%
You can use your control over a wide area but its limited to subtle or what could be considered natural effects and changes.

How does this meet the price requirement though?

[naloth]

Originally Posted by ericthered

Ok, creative use of obscure --- I'd thought of it for fog, but sound is good and I'm wondering now if it can be legitimately used creatively for other 'senses'.

Extended (other senses) is a modifier in basic and an example somewhere for creating flashbang (light/sound) grenades.

That's were things get hand wavy. Area effect Resistance to weather sounds really funny and I can't decide if its a fantastically creative idea or a terrible idea.

It's both ;) From a mechanics perspective giving someone a +1 to negate a -1 from something else works out. Visualization would also be a viable substitute, since you could "mass bless" an area in one specific way.

This way to do it mainly has the problem that it doesn't extend well-- meaning I need an entirely new set of abilities for oceans, avalanches, crops, and kingdom prosperity. And its really messy. But it does what I asked for.

That is the problem with specific game mechanics to deal with specific solutions. You know exactly what it can do (rather than letting the GM decide adhoc), but you also have to sit down and define exactly what it can do.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by ericthered

How does this meet the price requirement though?

Wekk its +50% instead of +100% for the area effect, so lower base for your limitations.
Immediate Preparation required would be the first one I use here.

[aesir23]

This is a bit out-there, but I think:

Serendipity (Wishing +100%, Focused (Weather Only) -40) (24/Level)

is perfectly fair approach, considering that fortuitous weather is something that could happen anyway.

[Shostak]

Originally Posted by ericthered

The ability I need has the following:

• can cause or stop rain, fog, or wind that could naturally happen in an area at a given time
• makes such things happen on a natural scale, taking from 1 minute (for making heavy rain laden cloulds), to a few hours (for a freak rain storm in the sahara)
• mechanically indistinguishable from normal weather.
• Manipulation of the effect is limited to large scale shaping: wind direction is doable. Raining on half a city is doable -- though the other half will see heavy clouds. raining on a single house is not.
• Duration related to either concentration or the natural life of the weather form
• Low Point cost is eminently prefferable (Multiplicative modifiers are in play)
• RAW is strongly prefferred, as is minimizing hand waving.

Help me understand the west way to make a weather ability that's strategic level only, and make it affordable!

I'd not get bogged down with worrying about appropriate cost for all the little niggley bits the major effect can cause (like obscuring vision with fog, etc.). Use realm or syntactic magic. Mastery of Air and water should give the ability to stop rain or dispel clouds.