10-04-2017, 06:07 PM | #31 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
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And IIRC, Stark became Iron Man in '62, when Kennedy was still active, though I don't think Marvel actually referenced the sitting President in the early stuff until LBJ took office. Fantastic Four and Hank Pym came in '61 (though Pym didn't take the Ant-Man identity until '62); Spider-Man, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, and Sgt. Fury started in '62 (though the latter was set in WWII); and I'm pretty sure Daredevil, the X-Men, and Doctor Strange started in '63. The Avengers didn't form until late '63, IIRC. In Iron Man, Ant-Man, and Hulk's titles, communists - either Chinese or Russian - were frequent bad guys. Getting back on topic, Black Widow started as a Soviet KGB operative working against Stark, and maneuvered Hawkeye into conflict with shell-head through her feminine wiles (among other skills in her arsenal).
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"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting Last edited by Phantasm; 10-04-2017 at 06:10 PM. |
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10-04-2017, 06:16 PM | #32 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
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10-04-2017, 06:16 PM | #33 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
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I don't think the MCU continuity supports her being older than she looks.
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Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
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10-04-2017, 06:21 PM | #34 | |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
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She isn't that old, but she is the product of an institution that is. |
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10-04-2017, 07:07 PM | #35 |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
Yes, exactly. She could perfectly well have been through a training program that went back to Stalin's days, without having been alive in that era. Nothing I said was intended to rule that out.
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Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
10-04-2017, 07:08 PM | #36 |
Wielder of Smart Pants
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
Yeah I read "wasn't any hint" as "there was no hint of a connection" which wasn't what you meant.
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10-04-2017, 07:17 PM | #37 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
Quote:
Again, the super-soldier program that comics!Nat is a recipient of was a relatively recent retcon in order to keep her WWII appearances (remembered by both Steve Rogers during the Pacific campaigns prior to his final fateful mission in Europe - itself a retcon from Avengers v1 #4 - and Wolverine, who at the time was apparently Canadian special forces, though Logan's own memory of the era is questionable) viable in the sliding time scale instead of merely topical. Mind, the tales with Wolverine and an infant Natasha Romanoff were written almost two decades ('80s and '90s) before they wrote Wolverine: Origins, so I'm not sure how much survived the Quesada era. As I recall, Black Widow was pushing 30 in-universe in the mid '80s to early '90s (when she was running around in a gray bodysuit with a spider insignia on her left breast, and close-cropped hair - and occasionally an Avengers-logo leather jacket... yeah, those were a thing in the early '90s) - the super-soldier program retcon occurred in the late '90s or '00s, IIRC. In-universe, I'd probably peg her at 35 without the serum; with it, she's the most active 75 year old character out there. :)
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"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting |
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10-04-2017, 08:27 PM | #38 | |
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Lawrence, KS
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
Quote:
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Bill Stoddard I don't think we're in Oz any more. |
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10-06-2017, 03:57 AM | #39 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
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So for instance take the hallway fight scene in Ironman 2, if you and your GM are looking to emulate that and stat the Security guards as being ST/HP/DX 11, Skill 13 Then yep we can help build character that will look like that fight scene. If however you want her to also look exactly like that when fighting a bunch opponents with ST/HP/DX 20, skill 25 and whole bunch "of keep em fighting" advantages, then that's different (but I'm sure people can help you with that as well) |
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10-06-2017, 01:26 PM | #40 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: On the road again...
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Re: Trying to make Black Widow
While people often focus on Widow's combat skills, they also tend to forget that she's a master manipulator, infiltrator, and double agent. In the movies (and referenced in Agents of SHIELD), she has a lifetime's training in "becoming the mask", is able to fool a former Soviet general and Loki into divulging critical information by appearing to be in a position of weakness when she was in control the whole time, and is possibly able to defeat SHIELD/Hydra-quality lie detector tests that were designed to beat her (AoS S1 was ambiguous on that last point).
To this end, I highly recommend giving her Acting and Body Language at 16+, bolstered by a high Per score and the other skills from the Smooth Operator talent. She is as much a Face character as she is a Scrapper. I built her with an eye towards the female Russian agent (played by Barbara Bach) in The Spy Who Loved Me (one of Roger Moore's James Bond films): able to kick ass, look good doing it, plow through mooks, fight those of her own caliber to a standstill, and manipulate everyone around her into giving up crucial information.
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"Life ... is an Oreo cookie." - J'onn J'onzz, 1991 "But mom, I don't wanna go back in the dungeon!" The GURPS Marvel Universe Reboot Project A-G, H-R, and S-Z, and its not-a-wiki-really web adaptation. Ranoc, a Muskets-and-Magery Renaissance Fantasy Setting |
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