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Old 03-30-2018, 06:36 PM   #1
WanderingMonster1
 
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Default Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

I've heard that Thaumatology: Sorcery is the simplest magic system to use for many games and it's pretty well balanced. However, for a setting with more rigid powers like Naruto, I've heard Powers is the best approach.

Are these statements true?
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Old 03-30-2018, 06:51 PM   #2
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

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Originally Posted by WanderingMonster1 View Post
I've heard that Thaumatology: Sorcery is the simplest magic system to use for many games and it's pretty well balanced. However, for a setting with more rigid powers like Naruto, I've heard Powers is the best approach.

Are these statements true?
Sorcery is actually just a specific worked instance of Magic as Powers. It's actually slightly more complicated than just using Powers outright, but also has the advantage that it's cheaper to have a lot of spells, since they are all essentially built as Alternate Abilities of each other (and it also allows for characters to improvise spells on the fly, although this isn't easy for the characters to pull off). Sorcery is also meant to be more rigid than Powers - while with Powers you are likely to have players build their spells and the GM approve them, for Sorcery you are meant to have a set pool of spells that you can use, all either from official sources or made by the GM, and the players can't design their own spells. That said, in the latter case having a character develop a new spell (which would probably be built by the GM with player input) could be a significant plot element (and might even use some variation of the Invention rules).
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Old 03-30-2018, 09:01 PM   #3
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

Another advantage of Sorcery is its worked examples so you have a starting Grimoire.
However for Naruto you might look at Thaumatology: Chinese Elemental Powers which is another Powers based system with worked rituals.
As its based on 5 elements its closer to the concept of Naruto but you would need Powers to build other elements or hybrid ones,
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Old 03-31-2018, 02:26 AM   #4
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

Naruto is a mess, with a lack of proper internal organization, if you want to put something like it into your game you'll have to deal with thing like:

The fact that Genjutsu is probably a sub-set of Ninjutsu.
Henge and Bushin probably should be Genjutsu, but aren't.
Many things are classified as separate abilities when they aren't, Naruto's Sexy no Jutsu is treated as a separate Jutsu from Henge, despite the fact that it's a pretty basic Henge realistically.
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Old 03-31-2018, 05:27 AM   #5
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

Sorcery is as well-balanced as building abilities from scratch, which means that things like direct attacks are vastly cheaper than reliably making someone sneeze or making your character invisible. It doesn't matter much though, since it's unlikely that your magic user will have to decide between an attack power and something else. It just means some spell builds are inherently less attractive than others because of point costs.

Word of warning though, GURPS Thaumatology: Sorcery has only two or three spells per college as worked-out examples, though these are most often the tricky ones. GURPS Sorcery: Protection and Warning Spells has most (maybe all) what's in that college and there two more in PY3/82: Magical Creations and there's an early version of the Fire College in PY3/63: Infinite Worlds II. The rest you have to build from scratch or pilfer from other sources. A little digging should yield a couple of useful threads, though. It's not ready to play out of the box. If you want a larger grimoire you need look at Ritual Path Magic or standard Magic.
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Old 03-31-2018, 07:40 AM   #6
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

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Originally Posted by Blind Mapmaker View Post
Sorcery is as well-balanced as building abilities from scratch, which means that things like direct attacks are vastly cheaper than reliably making someone sneeze or making your character invisible. It doesn't matter much though, since it's unlikely that your magic user will have to decide between an attack power and something else. It just means some spell builds are inherently less attractive than others because of point costs.

Word of warning though, GURPS Thaumatology: Sorcery has only two or three spells per college as worked-out examples, though these are most often the tricky ones. GURPS Sorcery: Protection and Warning Spells has most (maybe all) what's in that college and there two more in PY3/82: Magical Creations and there's an early version of the Fire College in PY3/63: Infinite Worlds II. The rest you have to build from scratch or pilfer from other sources. A little digging should yield a couple of useful threads, though. It's not ready to play out of the box. If you want a larger grimoire you need look at Ritual Path Magic or standard Magic.
I have another question. What is the best magic system where you can teach others magic?
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Old 03-31-2018, 09:11 AM   #7
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

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I have another question. What is the best magic system where you can teach others magic?
What do you mean by best? Most engaging to play out learning? A nice steady progression of power? a quick return on points invested?

I don't think any magic system stands out more than any other in terms of having teaching built into it. Gurps uses pretty much the same mechanics for all forms of teaching. Skills do have slightly more support and so a skill based system will have just a little more. I would also be remiss not to mention worminghall, which is a school for wizards in a pseudo-historical England. It uses the standard magic system, with some tweaking. I think its mostly a setting book, not a crunch book.

If you're looking for a quick return on points invested, you're looking at a skill based system, which means pretty much anything other than sorcery or powers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingMonster1 View Post
I've heard that Thaumatology: Sorcery is the simplest magic system to use for many games and it's pretty well balanced. However, for a setting with more rigid powers like Naruto, I've heard Powers is the best approach.

Are these statements true?
If you have rigid power sets and can name every supernatural feat a character can full off, magic as powers is awesome. You build it once, get exactly what you want, and move on.

I wouldn't call Sorcery the simplest magic system. It interacts heavily with the powers point concepts and you need to build a number of spells to get the most out of it.

That title probably goes to standard magic. Standard magic has odd breakpoints and quirks, but in the end you simply find what you want, pay the FP, and cast the spell. You can make it complicated, but you don't have to. The biggest advantage behind standard magic is that its easy to use.

The easiest alternative magic system depends on what about a magic system is hard for you. I suspect the answer is to take a complex one and chop off the fiddly bits.

EDIT: Yes, its sounds like I'm advocating the standard system. I actually don't like it that much. But its the system that plugs into learning best and is the easiest to use right away. Use the right tool for the right job.
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Old 03-31-2018, 09:42 AM   #8
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

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Originally Posted by WanderingMonster1 View Post
I have another question. What is the best magic system where you can teach others magic?
If you mean a system where you can teach someone for 200 hours and he gets 1 pts' worth of magic then anything Gurps could get the title except that Sorcery and Magic-as-Powers don't give you very much for 1pt/200 hours.

Standard Magic will give a whole new Spell. Path/Book Magic will give you (mostly) +1 to cast a Ritual or even base access to a new Path or Book should you come across one of those.
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Old 03-31-2018, 10:39 AM   #9
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

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Originally Posted by WanderingMonster1 View Post
I have another question. What is the best magic system where you can teach others magic?
Do you mean teach the players or their characters can easily learn and teach?
Each system has their own flavor and advantages,
I briefly describe and categorize the various systems on my blog at http://refplace.blogspot.com/p/other...ides-that.html
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My GURPS Wiki entries

Last edited by Refplace; 03-31-2018 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 03-31-2018, 04:51 PM   #10
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Default Re: Is what I've heard about GURPS alternative magic system true?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingMonster1 View Post
I've heard that Thaumatology: Sorcery is the simplest magic system to use for many games and it's pretty well balanced. However, for a setting with more rigid powers like Naruto, I've heard Powers is the best approach.

Are these statements true?
I've played and DM'd a lot of games using Sorcery, and for the most part it's a very solid system. I would absolutely suggest pulling out anything to do with Hardcore Improvisation though - in my experience it results in spellcasters effectively having access to any spell effect that isn't bothered by a 3 second casting time and a lunch break after. It also encourages very long duration buff spells that you never learn, but improv up once a day and cast on yourself/your allies.
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