[MH] Archer - variant Commando or variant Warrior?

[Anders]

Weapon Master usually goes by weapon, not by skills, yet you seem to put all Bows - longbows, composite bows, compound bows, etc. into one category (and similarly with Crossbows). Is this intentional? An errata to the Basic Set?

[PK]

Originally Posted by Asta Kask

Weapon Master usually goes by weapon, not by skills, yet you seem to put all Bows - longbows, composite bows, compound bows, etc. into one category (and similarly with Crossbows). Is this intentional? An errata to the Basic Set?

A clarification. As Kromm has stated on these fora, the "Bow" in Weapon Master (Bow) is intended to apply to longbows, short bows, etc., equally. For WM purposes, they're the same kind of weapon, just as a Thrusting Broadsword and a normal Broadsword are the same kind of weapon for WM purposes.

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

As Kromm has stated on these fora, the "Bow" in Weapon Master (Bow) is intended to apply to longbows, short bows, etc., equally. For WM purposes, they're the same kind of weapon, just as a Thrusting Broadsword and a normal Broadsword are the same kind of weapon for WM purposes.

Thanks for that. Finding a way to publish those clarifications, and clarifying the subject more generally, would be good. My idea of doing it by skill seems to be getting the right answer for the wrong reason.

[Kuroshima]

Jason, would you include fighting with the bow as if it was a baton in melee into the Archer package?

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by johndallman

Thanks for that. Finding a way to publish those clarifications, and clarifying the subject more generally, would be good. My idea of doing it by skill seems to be getting the right answer for the wrong reason.

The problem with doing it by skill is that you roll up things like batons, some kinds of katana, some kinds of falcheon, baseball bats wielded one handed, etc etc in with Weapon Master (Broadsword), along with bastard swords (sometimes), some kinds of katana (sometimes), longswords (sometimes), etc.

The thrusting and the regular Broadsword and a wooden practice sword? Sure, absolutely "close enough", and that's technically three different weapons - but the "regular" broadsword probably would have been a CF-based generic modifier for any Thrusting sword if they'd thought of that when the Basic Set for 4th ed was being written, and "wooden practice sword" is a modifier from Martial Arts... an orichalcum or Super Fine or Nanothorn broadsword would count as the same weapon too, most likely, even though they're all made from nonstandard materials.

It's not done by skill, because that's too broad. It's mostly done by entry on the weapon tables, but a blanket ruling on that part can't be made, because the weapon tables aren't organized for the benefit of Weapon Master - whether something gets its own line or not has more to do with how tight pagecount is on a given book than with whether it's really a different weapon.
There's a ton of weapons with all their variations written up as notes instead of weapon-table lines in High-Tech, due to that book being very crunched for space :(

[blacksmith]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

A clarification. As Kromm has stated on these fora, the "Bow" in Weapon Master (Bow) is intended to apply to longbows, short bows, etc., equally. For WM purposes, they're the same kind of weapon, just as a Thrusting Broadsword and a normal Broadsword are the same kind of weapon for WM purposes.

I don't see why they count as the same thing but say a long sword counts differently. In terms of length difference it is smaller with the swords.

Is a longbow and a Yumi the same even though they one is held in the center and the other about a third of the way up?

[blacksmith]

So would weapon master Kukri would include all sizes of kukri from the stats under Kukri to small and regular Falchions? Or is that a case were the word is too imprecise.


What about Katana and Late Katana?

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

Archer! (DX)

Bows and crossbows are like an extension of your body, mind, and soul. You can use this skill to fire any such weapon, replacing Bow, Crossbow, and even Artillery and Gunner skills to use ballistae, scorpions, etc. (Note that, from this point on, the term "bow" is used to refer to any handheld bow or crossbow weapon.) If you know this skill at DX+1 or better, replace your ST with your ST-based Archer! for all purposes when using a bow. You may also use IQ-based Archer! to replace Zen Marksmanship (but no other cinematic skills) if you have either Heroic Archer or a Weapon Master that includes bows.

You may roll against Archer! in place of Acrobatics, Dancing, Jumping, etc., to move while using your bow, to retain your weapon when being disarmed, or to replace any general DX roll the GM calls for involving your weapon. Archer! includes ammo handling as well; you may use it to replace Fast-Draw (Arrow), any DX roll to retain or pick up an arrow/bolt, and in place of Knife to stab someone with an arrow/bolt.

An IQ-based roll allows you to do things comparable to Gun! skill -- from identifying where an arrow was made based on the wood and fletching (Connoisseur) to knowing exactly where on an electrical box to shoot to knock out power to a place (Electrician). As well, you have an archer's eyes -- while shooting or aiming your bow, you may replace any Perception or Observation roll made to acquire a target, notice something wrong, hear someone sneaking up on you from behind, etc., with a Per-based Archer! roll.

OK, I just have to say WOW!