Proper Tech Level for an 1980s Setting

[dcarson]

Scanned Sears catalogs http://www.grayflannelsuit.net/ephem...ndex-main.html

1958
1969
1980

And a site that has them for many years http://searscatalogsonline.com
1897-1992

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Agemegos

Unless you are doing time travel, hopping parallel universe, or visiting multiple worlds in a Traveller-like interstellar setting, tech level does not matter. Use the equipment actually available at the time, the actual incomes of the time, a starting wealth that feels about right for the campaign you want, and ignore the "/TL" suffixes on skills.

Remember that GURPS is a toolkit and was designed with the expectation that you will not use rules that your campaign doesn't need. TL is not a rules module that most campaigns need.

While there is a lot of truth in this, note that TL transition periods are also when character concepts that are highlighted by their attitude to new technology are popular. The old cop with his wheelgun vs. the young one wielding a Super-Nine is a classic 80s trope and anything from Quirks about preferring tried-and-true methods or equipment to full-blown Low TL Disadvantage may crop up on PCs and NPCs.

[Agemegos]

Originally Posted by Icelander

While there is a lot of truth in this, note that TL transition periods are also when character concepts that are highlighted by their attitude to new technology are popular. The old cop with his wheelgun vs. the young one wielding a Super-Nine is a classic 80s trope and anything from Quirks about preferring tried-and-true methods or equipment to full-blown Low TL Disadvantage may crop up on PCs and NPCs.

Novelty, neophilia, and neophobia are not confined to "transition periods", which are fictitious. Technological change is continuous.

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Agemegos

Novelty, neophilia, and neophobia are not confined to "transition periods", which are fictitious. Technological change is continuous.

True, but gamable systems limit granularity to a certain minimum modifier to the difficulty of accomplishing tasks. As such, no matter what you call them, there will be tools and methods that are functionally the same in game terms and tools and methods that are differentiated by giving a modifier of some sort.

In GURPS, these are currently distinguished by TL modifiers to skills, with doing things 'the old fashioned way', i.e. as it was taught a few years ago, being a Disadvantage in GURPS campaigns set during periods where new tools and methods are coming into common use.

I've argued before that the 1980s and 1990s are far too different from our current era to be plausibly treated as the same TL, but it still remains a fact that during that era, the way people accomplished a lot of adventuring tasks was substantially changing. I certainly don't have a problem with the 80s being a different TL than the 60s, even if I'll argue that the 2010s ought to be yet another new TL.

The campaign I've run at this era focused on law enforcement technology, investigative methods and tactical gear. Speaking for myself, at least, I made substantial use of GURPS character traits having to do with TL. And when I ran a campaign using a system that didn't have similar rules for TL skills, I had to houserule modifiers to technical tasks according to character background, which in practice was basically assigning character skills TLs and applying modifiers for them.

A savvy, experienced detective who learned his trade in the 60s and hasn't kept up with the most recent technical advances is handicapped in certain situations, but can outperform more modern characters in situations where the new technology or methods are unavailable or not helpful.

[AlexanderHowl]

There are TL8 revolvers as well as TL7 automatics, so I do not quite understand the cop comparison. The reason why people prefer revolvers to automatics is that a revolver can still function if a round is a dud (in the case of an automatic, you need to take an action to clear the chamber). Revolvers also do not suffer from the issue of doubling up rounds in the barrel which, while uncommon, will still happen with automatics that suffer from bad maintenance (with the resulting explosion destroying the weapon and occasionally destroying the hand).

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

There are TL8 revolvers as well as TL7 automatics, so I do not quite understand the cop comparison. The reason why people prefer revolvers to automatics is that a revolver can still function if a round is a dud (in the case of an automatic, you need to take an action to clear the chamber). Revolvers also do not suffer from the issue of doubling up rounds in the barrel which, while uncommon, will still happen with automatics that suffer from bad maintenance (with the resulting explosion destroying the weapon and occasionally destroying the hand).

The revolver was the overwhelming choice of police departments in the US at TL7 and during the 1980s, nearly all of them were in the process of switching to semi-automatic pistols in 9mm.

At TL7, revolvers and automatics existed side-by-side, viewed as each having their own advantages, with proponents of both existing. At TL8, the consensus of actual professionals is that revolvers are not suitable weapons for tactical situations.

In any case, the choice of sidearm, whether that's the newly issued 9mm semi-automatic that the department is switching to or his old-fashioned revolver that the older character has carried for longer than his younger partner has been alived, is a common trope or storytelling shorthand to indicate the different approaches taken by the characters and their respective views on new technology and methods.

[AlexanderHowl]

Well, the majority of police officers that I have known in the USA through the years tended to prefer revolvers for personal protection and only use semi-automatics because it is their service piece (though they do appreciate revolvers as backup pieces because they can be hidden without difficulty). It is a question of reliability (the first season of Daredevil actually had an episode that showed why professional combatants prefer revolvers to semi-automatics). A lot of people who pride themselves as sharpshooters also prefer revolvers to semi-automatics because they see revolvers as the equipment of experts who do not rely on volume of fire to make up for their lack of skill. In addition, many gun enthusiasts that I know in the USA prefer revolvers to semi-automatics because the gun restrictions that occur in response to mass shooting revolve around magazine capacity limitation and, since revolvers do not have magazines, they do not have to convert or destroy their beloved firearms.

The trope is more about experience versus inexperience rather than adherence to old technology versus adoption of new technology. A veteran cop is a better shot, so he or she only needs six rounds, while a rookie cop is a worse shot, so he or she needs fifteen rounds to get the same results. A veteran cop also appreciates reliability because they have known people (cops or civilians) who died when a semi-automatic misfired while a rookie cop lacks that life experience. Finally, a veteran cop emotionally understands that bullets do not stop when they miss people (and has seen bystanders injured or killed by a missed shot) while a rookie cop lacks that emotional understanding, so a veteran cop will aim and wait while a rookie cop will spray and pray.

[Agemegos]

Originally Posted by Icelander

True, but gamable systems limit granularity to a certain minimum modifier to the difficulty of accomplishing tasks. As such, no matter what you call them, there will be tools and methods that are functionally the same in game terms and tools and methods that are differentiated by giving a modifier of some sort.

In GURPS, these are currently distinguished by TL modifiers to skills, with doing things 'the old fashioned way', i.e. as it was taught a few years ago, being a Disadvantage in GURPS campaigns set during periods where new tools and methods are coming into common use.

At about 1980 it is. At about 1960 it isn't.

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by Icelander

The revolver was the overwhelming choice of police departments in the US at TL7 and during the 1980s, nearly all of them were in the process of switching to semi-automatic pistols in 9mm.
....

My father was a cop until his death in 1988. I never saw him with anything but a revolver.

[warellis]

I thought what really prompted the widespread adoption of the Wonder Nines was the 1997 North Hollywood Shootout? Well that and the US military adopting the Beretta 92 as its main pistol in the 1980s?