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Old 12-07-2018, 02:08 AM   #1
johndallman
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Default [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

Hidebound [-5] is a mundane mental disadvantage. You are not an original thinker, and rarely come up with new ideas. It’s pretty much the opposite of the Versatile advantage. It appeared during the GURPS 3e period, but I’m not sure just where.

The practical effect of this disadvantage is -2 to most Artist rolls (presumably not ones made to copy art), Engineer rolls for new inventions, all rolls for using the Gadgeteer advantage, and any other tasks requiring creativity or invention, which can affect a very wide range of skills. The Dull quirk is closely related. Note that Hidebound does not have a self-control roll; if you take this disadvantage, you’re stuck with it, unless you buy it off. It forms a significant part of three meta-traits: Automaton, Domestic Animal and Wild Animal.

Published templates for ghosts, spirits of places and undead often include Hidebound, as do ones for golems and robots. It’s surprisingly common on the Discworld, where the narrative-driven nature of reality tends to lead to typecasting. It plays an important role in Bio-Tech animal upgrades and medicine, and a real one in Boardroom and Curia organisation descriptions. Some Horror opponents suffer this disadvantage, and some don’t, although you would expect it. Infinite Worlds’ Centrum agents can suffer from Hidebound (they know their way is best), and several worlds’ super-soldiers know only their training. Lands Out Of Time cavemen often suffer from this disadvantage, and it’s part of the Green Mind meta-trait in Magic: Plant Spells. Yrth Fighting Styles has tactics for were-creatures, if they buy off their Hidebound. Space gives it to entire sapient species, and Tales of the Solar Patrol has examples. Transhuman Space LAIs are all Hidebound, and Zombies come close.

I’ve never used this disadvantage as a player, because doing strange things and coming up with weird solutions is one of the things I most like in RPGs. Has it been entertaining in your games?
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Old 12-07-2018, 07:17 AM   #2
ericthered
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

I've never used it either, but I'm looking at it and asking myself why not?


The penalties are pretty minimal for most characters. Yes, I'm more likely than most to play an inventor or a mage who wants to come up with a new spell* but on most characters this trait really doesn't hurt much. Sure, its not very heroic, but its not nearly as stodgy as the name made me think.



Such a character only struggles to come up with their own thoughts. Accepting the ideas of others is not penalized, though I could see an argument for making an NPC with hidebound resistant to seeing the merits of the PC's cool ideas.



As far as role-playing go, its very easy to play: you don't think of things.


It might be fun to play a game with characters with versatile and others with hidebound. Every-time a hidebound character's player comes up with an idea, they relay it to a versatile charater's player.



* Hidebound could very well be used to penalize never before performed rituals in RPM, or power stunts to use an ability in a new way. At least the first few times.
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Old 12-07-2018, 08:05 AM   #3
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
I've never used it either, but I'm looking at it and asking myself why not?
My reasoning: exposure to GMs who interpret a 5-point disadvantage giving '-2 to creative skill use' as "if you try to keep using creative skills at -2, I will add some additional penalties . . . and I will also try to expand the scope of penalties beyond the RAW either way". I have no idea why, but I've encountered several instances of GMs wanting interpret it more harshly than it's written.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:48 PM   #4
johndallman
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
Such a character only struggles to come up with their own thoughts. Accepting the ideas of others is not penalized, though I could see an argument for making an NPC with hidebound resistant to seeing the merits of the PC's cool ideas.
Hidebound plus Stubbornness will do that pretty well.
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Old 12-07-2018, 01:09 PM   #5
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
I've never used it either, but I'm looking at it and asking myself why not?
For me, when I play not as smart Characters, it's usually straight up lower IQ. Laddling on some extra penalties on top of that would be bad...

I figure that's probably where most Players are coming from.
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Old 12-07-2018, 06:57 PM   #6
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
My reasoning: exposure to GMs who interpret a 5-point disadvantage giving '-2 to creative skill use' as "if you try to keep using creative skills at -2, I will add some additional penalties . . . and I will also try to expand the scope of penalties beyond the RAW either way". I have no idea why, but I've encountered several instances of GMs wanting interpret it more harshly than it's written.
I've gotten to the point where my choice of Advantages/Disadvantages is highly influenced by the style of the GM I'm running under.
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Old 12-07-2018, 07:04 PM   #7
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
I've never used it either, but I'm looking at it and asking myself why not?



* Hidebound could very well be used to penalize never before performed rituals in RPM, or power stunts to use an ability in a new way. At least the first few times.
I'm with Eric.
Further I can think of certain players who should take this for most of thier characters.
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Old 12-08-2018, 11:22 AM   #8
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

IRL I find this often accompanies Delusion: I have Common Sense.
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Old 12-08-2018, 02:27 PM   #9
ericthered
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
My reasoning: exposure to GMs who interpret a 5-point disadvantage giving '-2 to creative skill use' as "if you try to keep using creative skills at -2, I will add some additional penalties . . . and I will also try to expand the scope of penalties beyond the RAW either way". I have no idea why, but I've encountered several instances of GMs wanting interpret it more harshly than it's written.
I am almost always the GM rather than the player, and I've never taken the disadvantage, so that's probably not it. I do think its one of those disadvantages where the name and the effect don't line up particuarly well. This makes people shy away from it or try to make it do things it shouldn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johndallman View Post
Hidebound plus Stubbornness will do that pretty well.
That's a nice combination. Good spot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evileeyore View Post
For me, when I play not as smart Characters, it's usually straight up lower IQ. Laddling on some extra penalties on top of that would be bad...

I figure that's probably where most Players are coming from.
I don't think "Dumb" when I think of this trait. This trait is great for otherwise bright people who go where they are based on hard work rather than natural talent. They know the book back to front, and go "by the book". Such characters don't have low IQ, they just struggle with some types of activities.
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Old 12-09-2018, 08:05 AM   #10
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the Week: Hidebound

I had a fantasy character with this one. He had a bunch of mental problems and most manifested in his 50+ points of social disadvantages, but this one is in the mental category. None of the skill penalties came in to play because he never had the skills or inclination, and he was never the planning guy. In the role-playing realm, he had his routines and his rules and they didn't have room for exceptions unless someone nudged him out of them.

Once, when we were in Waterdeep for an extended period of time, the bad guys figured out his running route and ambushed him.

Another time, Hidebound combined with Callous and Oblivious (Really messed up guy) to create one of the worst social interactions of the campaign. He tended to pigeonhole interactions and didn't understand when things were outside his scope of experience, so he'd just ask, bluntly and crudely. We had rescued a female paladin on the road. As thanks, she covered our rooms for the night at the inn in the next town. My character, Dog, was confused. He waited until everyone but the two of them had left the table.

Dog: Do you want to <have sex>?
Paladin: *Spits out drink* um... what?
Dog: Well, you bought us rooms. And last time I saved some woman's life and she bought me a room at an inn, everyone said it was so we could <have sex>.
Paladin: um... Well... I...
Dog: But then you bought rooms for all of us. So that would mean you want to <have sex with> all of us. That seems weird, but paladins are weird. So, do you want to <have sex>?
Paladin: Well... um... You're a nice looking guy and all, but...
Dog: *patiently eats his chicken while waiting for an answer*
Paladin: That... um... wasn't what I had in mind...
Dog: Ok then. *continues eating chicken*
Paladin: *leaves the table trying to figure out what just happened*
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