Forgive an old newbie...

[Grey Goblin]

I used to play 3rd ed. Now I'm just starting 4th. Apologies for questions that have already been answered elsewhere. Thanks for your replies!

Do points gained from reduced attribute scores count towards the Disadvantages limit? Ex: A 100 point character with -50 points in Disadvantages allowed takes a -1 to STR. Does that character now have -40 points left in Disadvantages or still -50 points?

More questions later, I'm sure. Thanks again for your patience!

EDIT: I see that skills are generally off limits to Limitations. It looks like everything else is fair game, but what about Basic Attributes? Can they be limited?

[Mateus]

Originally Posted by Grey Goblin

I used to play 3rd ed. Now I'm just starting 4th. Apologies for questions that have already been answered elsewhere. Thanks for your replies!

Do points gained from reduced attribute scores count towards the Disadvantages limit? Ex: A 100 point character with -50 points in Disadvantages allowed takes a -1 to STR. Does that character now have -40 points left in Disadvantages or still -50 points?

More questions later, I'm sure. Thanks again for your patience!

EDIT: I see that skills are generally off limits to Limitations. It looks like everything else is fair game, but what about Basic Attributes? Can they be limited?

The final word is from the GM, but, as written, everything counts. So your ST-1 "eats up" 10 points from the disadvantage limite of the campaing. It also true for secondary characteristcs, languages, etc. The only exception normaly are the quirks.

[David Johnston2]

Yes any reduction from your racial norm counts against the disad limit. (Of course disad limits are typically larger now.)

[RobKamm]

B11, under Disadvantage Limit, says that "A disadvantage is anything with a negative cost, including low attributes. . ."

Basic Attributes probably won't mix well with most Limitations. However, I could see Extra-Attribute advantages (and disadvantages) getting them. So, for example, a character might have ST 10 normally, but Extra ST 1 (for an 11) at night (-20%) would only cost 8 points instead of the usual 10.

Welcome back to GURPS. I hope you like the new version.

[mlangsdorf]

Basic Attributes are canonically subject to Limitations: see the Size modifier for ST and the No Fine Manipulators for ST and DX.

[RobKamm]

Originally Posted by mlangsdorf

Basic Attributes are canonically subject to Limitations: see the Size modifier for ST and the No Fine Manipulators for ST and DX.

Yes, the ones that are specific to them. I (perhaps foolishly) assumed he was referring to the more general list of limitations.

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by RobKamm

B11, under Disadvantage Limit, says that "A disadvantage is anything with a negative cost, including low attributes. . ."

Basic Attributes probably won't mix well with most Limitations. However, I could see Extra-Attribute advantages (and disadvantages) getting them. So, for example, a character might have ST 10 normally, but Extra ST 1 (for an 11) at night (-20%) would only cost 8 points instead of the usual 10.

Or someone who would normally be ST 10 but has ST 30 as the result of a Pact with a supernatural being; that would give a discount to the additional Strength as well.

Basically, if you can make the case for a Limitation and your GM agrees, more power to you.

(Welcome back!)

[BaHalus]

I got sad with this new disadvantage limit. I like the idea of adjusting attributes. At I loved the idea of secondary attributes, thinking that they too would not count towards disadvantages limits, but become frustrated as I discovered that even negative attributes counts now.

I am still playing 3ed, experimenting with some elements of 4ed. The new way to deal with allies seemed to me great at first glance, but strange at second glance when I thought about high point and low point games. Same thing about the new suggested disadvantage limits. It seems to produce a very low limit to commoners and very high limit to supers (unless limitations counted to disadvantage limit, but they don't).

I like the new rules for quirks and the simplified skill cost table and the linear cost of attributes, but I don't like that it made intelligent characters more expensive and physical ones cheaper.

I think it is strange that there is no more a bonus to shot someone at less than 2m of distance, it seems weird that a gun at 2cm and 2m of the target has the same chance to hit.

I still have to read the new superST rules, I am still confused by them.

I liked the alternative abilities and modular abilities a lot, it enables certain concepts that would be inefficient in 3ed. I liked the new way to deal with familiars and weres too.

[Mateus]

Originally Posted by BaHalus

I got sad with this new disadvantage limit. I like the idea of adjusting attributes. At I loved the idea of secondary attributes, thinking that they too would not count towards disadvantages limits, but become frustrated as I discovered that even negative attributes counts now.

I am still playing 3ed, experimenting with some elements of 4ed. The new way to deal with allies seemed to me great at first glance, but strange at second glance when I thought about high point and low point games. Same thing about the new suggested disadvantage limits. It seems to produce a very low limit to commoners and very high limit to supers (unless limitations counted to disadvantage limit, but they don't).

I like the new rules for quirks and the simplified skill cost table and the linear cost of attributes, but I don't like that it made intelligent characters more expensive and physical ones cheaper.

I think it is strange that there is no more a bonus to shot someone at less than 2m of distance, it seems weird that a gun at 2cm and 2m of the target has the same chance to hit.

I still have to read the new superST rules, I am still confused by them.

I liked the alternative abilities and modular abilities a lot, it enables certain concepts that would be inefficient in 3ed. I liked the new way to deal with familiars and weres too.

Remember the rule of gold: "the GM has the final word". And also dont forget that in YUOR game you can play as you want. There are people onthis forum that dont even use disadvantages or give points for selecting them.

[Mateus]

Originally Posted by BaHalus

The new way to deal with allies seemed to me great at first glance, but strange at second glance when I thought about high point and low point games.

Supers has alternative tables for allies, as have the DF line regarding minions for the Necromancer.