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Old 03-04-2018, 09:09 AM   #1
ArchonShiva
 
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Default Using a bow above your ST

Tiny rule change in DFRPG, instead of being completely unable to use bows above your ST, you now have the same skill penalty and FP cost equal to the difference as for other weapons. (DFA98)

What didn't change is that you still use the weapon's rated ST to calculate range and damage.

Now, I'd like to triple-check before I break scouts all over again (as if they need it!):

If a scout with Weapon Master (bow) uses a ST19 longbow, they get 2d+5 imp damage. They will have a skill penalty of -6 (assuming Strongbow perk) or less*, and pay 6 FP (or less*) after each fight. Using fine arrows, they'll do a sweet 2d+6 imp or cut.

Am I missing any obvious reasons why this is completely illegal?

*I mean less if they increase ST somehow.
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Last edited by ArchonShiva; 03-04-2018 at 12:42 PM. Reason: DFRPG doesn’t convert adds to dice
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Old 03-04-2018, 10:32 AM   #2
Gnomasz
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Amazingly, it seems right. Personally I'd say it doesn't make sense and would use the lower of rated ST and user's ST in a realistic game… but this game isn't supposed to be realistic, so I guess -2 to skill for +1 to damage if a specific condition is met is acceptable.
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Old 03-04-2018, 10:58 AM   #3
ArchonShiva
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Now that you mention it, 2 skill for 1 damage seems to be the base exchange rate in DFRPG*, such as All-Out Attack choosing +2 damage or +4 skill. With the added FP cost, maybe it’s not that insane. It’s just the combination of the 2d breakpoint with Weapon Master that makes it seem so crazy, but that actually might be an Weapon Master issue more than a bow issue...

Thanks for the perspective!

*GURPS has even more examples of 2 skill for 1 damage.
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Old 03-04-2018, 12:20 PM   #4
evileeyore
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchonShiva View Post
If a scout with Weapon Master (bow) uses a ST19 longbow...
They bought themselves up to ST 12 though yes? (Strongbow is +2, Elven Bow is +2...)

Quote:
...they get 2d+6 imp damage.
You want to walk me through where your getting 2d+6?

ST 19 is 2d-1 thr, Longbow is thr +2, Weapon Master is +2 per die...

I'm seeing 2d+5*.

* Am I missing a bonus somewhere? My ST 17 Half Ogre Scout wants to know... ;) And thanks for the nod to this... he'll have to pick up a ST 27 Elven Bow now... /twothumbsup

Quote:
Using fine arrows, they'll do a sweet 3d imp or cut.
I'm getting 2d+6 here... and... DFRPG doesn't round the damage dice*. (That's an optional rule out of Basic)


* Big fat sweet bonuses are sort of in the wheelhouse of the genre.

Quote:
*I mean less if they increase ST somehow.
Or take Very Fit... ;)
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Old 03-04-2018, 12:43 PM   #5
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

A manual implementation of Strongbow in GCS, which became redundant when I had to override the weapon’s damage. I fixed the numbers, thanks for pointing out my mistake.
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Old 03-04-2018, 01:54 PM   #6
evileeyore
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchonShiva View Post
A manual implementation of Strongbow in GCS, which became redundant when I had to override the weapon’s damage. I fixed the numbers, thanks for pointing out my mistake.
No worries... and like I said "Thanks for pointing this out!" it's yet another difference between DFRPG and regular GURPS that I hadn't caught on to!
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Old 03-04-2018, 06:02 PM   #7
Tom H.
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

I noticed another related difference between GURPS and Dungeon Fantasy (RPG).

According to Adventurers (pg. 98) bows are now also purchased with a rated ST (in addition to crossbows and prodds Basic Set, pg. 270).

I was curious if I missed the memo and if bows required a rated ST before the DFRPG? Does anyone have any insight into this apparent change?
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Old 03-04-2018, 07:19 PM   #8
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom H. View Post
I was curious if I missed the memo and if bows required a rated ST before the DFRPG? Does anyone have any insight into this apparent change?
Bows were added to the relevant sections of GURPS Basic in the second or third printing. I don't think it's mentioned in the official errata for some reason.

That has caused some interesting conversations over the years.
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Old 03-04-2018, 08:53 PM   #9
Tom H.
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Hey thanks Dalzig.

It must have been 3rd printing of Characters as I own the 2nd printing.
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Old 03-04-2018, 10:14 PM   #10
Tom H.
 
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Default Re: Using a bow above your ST

Oh, cool.

I just checked my copy of Low-Tech and the ST rating for bows was included there on pg. 74, 75.

That was a good, official place to include such a change.
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