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Old 03-23-2018, 05:16 AM   #31
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

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Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
A lot of people reportedly can't get away from coffee the way others can't get away from smoking. But my personal experience with coffee is that I underwent several sudden and long-term (from several months to a couple years) shifts from drinking three cups a day to drinking none, with no ill effect. Somehow I think that coffee does not correlate with lung cancer, but the differences between people who can just decide to stop and those who can't still seems to exist.
There is a significant difference, however, with chemicals that may technically be habit-forming, but are not debilitating, expensive, illegal or likely to have any negative impact on a person's life. There is little evidence for long-term health risks from caffeine consumption and there have been many studies. Granted, one could probably find a study that links coffee with carcinogens, but given that any creature that lives long enough is probably going to get cancer, there are a lot of things that correlate with cancer. Like toast, orange juice and water, for example.

There is simply no reason to believe that the morning coffee is any more dangerous than morning toast. With that in mind, many people may not be so addicted that giving coffee up is impossible, they may simply lack any motivation to stop consuming a beverage that they somehow, inexplicably, enjoy.*

I don't think I'm addicted to Indian food, but I'd need a very strong and compelling reason to agree to give it up, because I like Indian food.

*Not a coffee person.
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Old 03-23-2018, 06:45 PM   #32
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

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Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
A lot of people reportedly can't get away from coffee the way others can't get away from smoking. But my personal experience with coffee is that I underwent several sudden and long-term (from several months to a couple years) shifts from drinking three cups a day to drinking none, with no ill effect. Somehow I think that coffee does not correlate with lung cancer, but the differences between people who can just decide to stop and those who can't still seems to exist.
I wouldn't call three cups a day much of a habit.

With spring getting under way, my SAD means I have to all but quit caffeine.
I get headaches when dropping dose too quickly. I drink diet soda rather than coffee though.
And we shouldn't confuse chemical dependency with addiction.
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Old 03-24-2018, 03:19 AM   #33
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

Part of the problem here is that "addiction" has been used by all sorts of people to mean all sorts of different things, to the point that it's not a terribly useful word any more except in a very broad and fuzzy sense.
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Old 03-24-2018, 02:02 PM   #34
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

This thread makes me miss significant doses of caffeine so much. Trace amounts don't bother me, but I can no longer drink coffee, soda pop, or tea unless it is decaffeinated (plus some additional restrictions). Well, I can drink it, but it kicks me like a mule unless I restrain myself to a single serving... which still is unpleasant and leaves me "off" for a day or two.

So, relevance to the discussion? I've avoided a lot of the more obvious addictions in my life: I don't drink or smoke or use some other drugs. I badly struggle with Gluttony, however, and the only reason I'm not as bad as I used to be about overeating is because the same condition that forces me to indulge in caffeinated beverages no more than once every few months (and that is a recent change - I went about 10 years without any before that) is because of the pain consuming them causes.

So in a sense, I'm still addicted. If it wasn't for the highly unpleasant side effects of "cheating" too much, which are variable and so also confusing (I once thought I was having a heart attack, but it usually mimics the stomach flu), I'd go back to drinking coffee in a heartbeat. And... still not sure how much this pertains to the discussion, other than wondering how to model it in game. ;)
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Old 03-24-2018, 02:43 PM   #35
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

Gurps generally considers anything past 2 months inconsequential. So I wouldn't call it an addiction. More like a quirk "Allergy" from the dietary restriction and nasty side effects.
My diabetic diet only counts for about -2, so I don't mean to sound dismissive of the real world hassles you deal with.
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Old 03-24-2018, 05:01 PM   #36
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
I wouldn't call three cups a day much of a habit.
Well, "must use daily or suffer withdrawal" seems to qualify for people who go from OK at 1-2/day to miserable after dropping to zero.

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Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
And we shouldn't confuse chemical dependency with addiction.
I wasn't confusing it dependency; dependency causes HP loss, addiction causes withdrawal (whether HT- or Will-based).
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Old 03-24-2018, 05:34 PM   #37
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

I meant the real world terms of chemical dependency and addiction not Gurps.
No one will die from coffee withdrawal, for example, even if they're fully addicted.
But back when I took Paxil, quitting suddenly was very dangerous even though I had no problem tapering down and quitting completely when it was of no more use.
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Old 03-25-2018, 06:29 AM   #38
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

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I meant the real world terms of chemical dependency and addiction not Gurps.
Well, this thread is about Addictions, whether or not they will qualify as addictions according to the 1138th redefinition of the real-world term.

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No one will die from coffee withdrawal, for example, even if they're fully addicted.
Okay, but they can still qualify for getting the share of quirks as scars of withdrawal. That being said, I never heard people dying from withdrawal from nicotine either.
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Old 03-25-2018, 08:05 AM   #39
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
Gurps generally considers anything past 2 months inconsequential. So I wouldn't call it an addiction. More like a quirk "Allergy" from the dietary restriction and nasty side effects.
My diabetic diet only counts for about -2, so I don't mean to sound dismissive of the real world hassles you deal with.
I was unclear; I don't want to go into too much detail as it falls into TMI for most folks. Then again, what I am really asking might require it. You see, I want to know how severe, not-too-far-removed consequences affect trying to resist an addiction.
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Old 03-25-2018, 02:16 PM   #40
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Default Re: [Basic] Disadvantage of the week: Addiction and Alcoholism

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Well, this thread is about Addictions, whether or not they will qualify as addictions according to the 1138th redefinition of the real-world term.

Okay, but they can still qualify for getting the share of quirks as scars of withdrawal. That being said, I never heard people dying from withdrawal from nicotine either.
True. I think the Withdrawal rules are often absurdly lethal. Only real world chemical dependencies have a chance at doing that, not the vast majority of addictive substances.
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