Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-22-2016, 02:45 PM   #61
Kalzazz
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Would it break anything to allow a dodge at say -3 to something which is generally somehow acting like it might want to dodge even if it can't see the specific attack? That's probably my biggest complaint, the rabbit fleeing the hunter (or the cat) can't try to dodge because its a rear hex
Kalzazz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 02:49 PM   #62
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalzazz View Post
Would it break anything to allow a dodge at say -3 to something which is generally somehow acting like it might want to dodge even if it can't see the specific attack? That's probably my biggest complaint, the rabbit fleeing the hunter (or the cat) can't try to dodge because its a rear hex
Rabbits don't have rear hexes, do they?
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident.
Ulzgoroth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 02:52 PM   #63
Andreas
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by DouglasCole View Post
Your question actually inverts the causality here. The origin of the relationship for Skill, Parry/Block, and Dodge is based on how penalties to DX are reflected:

Skill - penalty to DX is 1:1 with skill
Block/Parry - penalty to DX is 1:2 with skill, because Parry/Block are half skill
Dodge - penalty is 1:4 with DX, because Speed = (DX+HT)/4, and Dodge is based on Move which is based on Speed.

That said, plenty of things are "penalizes all defenses." If you want to unify them all, use the penalties for Parry/Block for Dodge.

But that's why the penalty for Dodge is low - it's 1/4 of the skill penalty.
Ah, now I see how you got 1/4. That methodology seems somewhat strange though. Why would the speed of the projectile only penalise DX? As seen in the formula for calculating Basic Speed, HT also affects how fast you can move in response to attacks.

Yes, using the Parry/Block values for Dodge as well seems like a better solution, though they are still rather low since even those make it possible for a reailistic human to dodge supersonic projectiles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
I see, I misunderstood your question. Basically, you want to know why the difference is based on a multiplier/divisor rather than a simple linear adjustment. I think my example gives a good reason why a linear adjustment is a bad idea - if Dodge is always at +6 relative to Parry, then at the low-speed end (where you'd actually expect to see most characters being able to pull this off) Dodge and Parry are going to be too different. For example, a thrown hatchet is at -1 to Block/Parry, +0 or so to Dodge, which is consistent with Basic Set rules. If we go with the linear adjustment, we can either maintain the old Block/Parry rules or the old Dodge rules. In the former case, Dodge gets a whopping +5 to Dodge a hatchet. In the latter case, Blocking/Parrying a hatchet is at -6. We could go for the worst of both worlds and split the difference, for +3 to Dodge and -3 to Block/Parry.
There would not have to be such a large difference between dodging and parrying. A difference of 2 or 3 seems more reasonable.
Andreas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 02:57 PM   #64
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andreas View Post
The penalties Dodge This assigns based on the speed of the projectile seem very small.
It probably shouldn't be based on speed at all, the relevant factor is 'how long before impact can you determine where the projectile is going to hit'.
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:06 PM   #65
Varyon
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalzazz View Post
Would it break anything to allow a dodge at say -3 to something which is generally somehow acting like it might want to dodge even if it can't see the specific attack? That's probably my biggest complaint, the rabbit fleeing the hunter (or the cat) can't try to dodge because its a rear hex
This is best represented as one of the various Evasive Movement rules (the Dodge This! version being the only RAW one I'm aware of) - that is, this is most appropriate as a penalty to hit rather than as an active defense. That said, Dodge at -4 (as for when fighting an invisible foe) is probably appropriate.
Varyon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:17 PM   #66
Kalzazz
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

There's also Acrobatic Movement in Martial Arts, which fits perfectly well for bouncey rabbits

I really would prefer to have it as a Dodge (though admittedly a dodge no rabbit will ever make at -4)
Kalzazz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:23 PM   #67
DouglasCole
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
 
DouglasCole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Burnsville, MN
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
(the Dodge This! version being the only RAW one I'm aware of)
I'd not consider Pyramid RAW, for what it's worth. These are vetted optional rules, but definitely OPTIONAL . . . like double-optional, because all of GURPS is optional, and Pyr more so.
__________________
Gaming Ballistic, LLC: Home of Dragon Heresy, Hall of Judgment, and hand-made viking shields.

Live on Kickstarter: The Citadel at Noršvorn. An epic Norse-inspired setting for the Dungeon Fantasy RPG.
DouglasCole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:23 PM   #68
Andreas
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
It probably shouldn't be based on speed at all, the relevant factor is 'how long before impact can you determine where the projectile is going to hit'.
Yes, looking at time rather than speed would be the most realistic approach, but a speed penalty can still be useful as an approximate value in situations where the distance to the attacker is neither exceptionally long or short.

Perhaps something like these might be reasonable values for Dodge penalties/bonuses

4 seconds: +12
2 seconds: +8
1 seconds: +4
0.5 seconds: +0
0.25 seconds: -4
0.125 seconds: -8
0.0625 seconds: -12
Andreas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:33 PM   #69
Kalzazz
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

I'm pretty sure that Kromm has said Pyramid = GURPS supplement

I consider the Dodge This! rules to be say just as RAW and just as optional as say the bleeding rules
Kalzazz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2016, 03:35 PM   #70
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Dodgin' Bullets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andreas View Post
Perhaps something like these might be reasonable values for Dodge penalties/bonuses

4 seconds: +12
2 seconds: +8
1 seconds: +4
0.5 seconds: +0
0.25 seconds: -4
0.125 seconds: -8
0.0625 seconds: -12
Nah, at the low end it's all dominated by reaction time anyway, which is adding around 200 ms. I'd probably just go with 'base of -4, +8 per second' or something similar.
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
guns, tactical shooting

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.