Invisibility negated by "combat spells"?

[Jeminai]

What is a combat spell?

A person who is invisible gets a one surprise attack, so if they have knife in had they can stab with it or throw it and they will become visible but that one attack will likely not be able to be defended.

Combat spells also negate invisibility but there are some issues we had in play with this.

1) the wizard who was invisible wanted to cast Lightning, charge it up and then attack with it. Most of us agree this was a combat spell and the moment it is cast, he is visible. Missile spells take 1 turn to cast (with a Concentrate maneuver) and then on the next turn it can be used to attack with (an Attack, All-out-Attack, etc.) The wizard asked, "Why does an invisible person get to knock an arrow, aim and fire, but I can't cast my missile spell and get one free attack?"

Note: one player offered the idea that the caster should remain invisible but the spell itself would be visible as a floating ball of lightning until the attack maneuver was taken to launch it, at which time the caster would become visible.

2) Is Grease a combat spell? It is used in combat all the time, but is this going to negate invisibility? What if Grease is cast outside of combat to lay a trap for some people following the PCs? Does it negate the spell only when there is an obvious combat application? Is the spell sentient and sapient now where it knows when you are in combat or what your intent is?

3) What about a Might spell cast on an ally? This is also a combat spell, but it is a buff spell? Does this negate invisibility?

4) What if an invisible person calls a feint maneuver against someone that has See Invisible active but want to remain invisible to others in the combat. Since the Feint is NOT actually an attack does the feinter become invisible or not?

I guess the real question is, just how intelligent is the invisibility spell.

One thing that was readily apparent from this conversation was that we now realized why in the original GURPS Magic, the writers did not have this caveat in the spell.

The other thing we noticed is that "combat spell" is too ambiguous.

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by Jeminai

The other thing we noticed is that "combat spell" is too ambiguous.

Which is why I switched the rule from "the spell ends instantly if the subject attacks, casts a combat spell, or does anything else more violent than moving, spying, or stealing" to "the spell ends instantly if the subject takes any action with the intent to cause immediate harm".

So the Wizard can cast a Lightning Bolt spell and hold it and is only revealed when he attacks with it. Casting Grease where enemies are about to walk (or under them) will drop invisibility, etc. And stealing something from someone that will cause them immediate harm (like an amulet that is keeping them alive) will stop invisibility. But stealing an Iron Skin Amulet wouldn't (unless it was stopping them from taking harm at that moment, somehow).


And yes, we do occasionally have discussions about what that means during play, but I've got a decent group and they don't often quibble the fine details.

[ArchonShiva]

I feel like I just asked that question recently, but can’t remember where.

I generally allow any non-resisted spells cats at the environment, resisted spells where the victim forgoes resistance, and resisted spells cast outside of combat that the victim doesn’t notice and that don’t trigger combat. I’d allow the entire Mind Control college except Terror (and Fascinate, because it requires eye contact). Casting a resisted spell at someone already in combat who doesn’t forgo their resistance makes you visible.

I actually don’t let invisible characters steal stuff, but that’s a house rule.