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#11 |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Have some of the DR be Ablative. Adjust amount to taste.
Add a sprinkling of basil.
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Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela! |
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#12 | ||
Forum Pervert
(If you have to ask . . .) Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Somewhere high up.
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BattleTech was actually this easy. I know Heavy Gear isn't, but I'm hoping that I can simplify it to where it is. You are very correct: Heavy Gear is much more abstract than GURPS. The funny part of it is that Heavy Gear actually gives us the information we would need to convert it into GURPS, but the numbers don't mesh with the way the game plays. Quote:
So, it's the Armor Value squared, divided by 25.4 to turn it into inches, then multiplied by 70. While I like this idea, and was looking at it, until all the ADR is gone, the vehicle still won't take any "damage." I'd rather add bacon. |
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#13 |
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The former Chochenyo territory
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If you keep increasing the Armor Divisor on the weapons, while reducing damage, I think you'll find the 'sweet spot' you're looking for.
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#14 | |
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Göttingen, Germany
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Though you're right that the loss of armor, is not "real damage" yet. Basically I'd try making it possible to destroy secondary systems like sensors more easily! The classic idea would be something like: "The missile hits your vehicle and blows up a part of your front armor. Apparently the optical sensors on the front are also damaged by this attack, though your radar system is still working." A possible option would be something like "Surge" from Powers p102, a weapon enhancement that forces damaged electronic systems to make HT checks against malfunctions or generally an Affliction Attack against electrical systems... And/or the systems that could likely be damaged, e.g. the Hyperspectral Vision advantage as a sensor array, could be bought with something like the "Breakable"-limitation... Last edited by OldSam; 03-19-2010 at 10:10 AM. |
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#15 | ||||
Forum Pervert
(If you have to ask . . .) Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Somewhere high up.
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So, generally, what I'm looking for is the Unified Theory of Heavy Gear. Quote:
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I'm thinking of just having all their aux systems protected by a lower armor value. |
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#16 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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When converting many systems to GURPS (and, from what I remember, Heavy Gear is no exception), you'll have the problem that in GURPS, the difference between 'target slightly damaged' and 'target obliterated' is quite small -- for armored vehicles, it might be as little as 50% more damage. In many other games, this difference is much larger; IIRC in heavy gear (been a long time) it takes about 4x as much damage (16x as much penetration) to obliterate a target as to slightly damage it. In Starcraft, to give another example, the difference between 'damage a battleship' (3 armor, so 4 points) and 'obliterate a battleship' (503 points) is more than a factor of 100.
Ablative DR or damage divisors are usually the easiest way to manage this. |
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#17 |
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Portland, Oregon
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A layer of Ablative DR, then Semi-Ablative DR and regular DR. Each one may have various levels of Hardened, depending on the suit itself.
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#18 |
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Göttingen, Germany
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Hmm, wouldn't that mean a bit too much calculation and keeping track of the different changing values during combat? I'd be afraid that it could noticeable reduce the game speed... Though it could work, didn't try it with several layers myself.
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#19 | ||
Forum Pervert
(If you have to ask . . .) Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Somewhere high up.
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And, I agree with OldSam: extra bookkeeping = bad. I’m a huge fan of KISS (the concept, not the band). Quote:
Another idea I’d had, and it’s probably a bad idea, is basing the Gear’s DR/HP off of it’s Overkill value (AV x 3). But, that strikes me as a bad idea. |
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#20 | |
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Endor
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My Heavy Gear books are in a box, at the moment, but working off the top of my head from shady memory: A Hunter mecha had armor roughly equivalent to a good armored car, didn't it? Or an old light tank? So, just for eyeballing, we grab the Cold War Armored Car stats from GURPS High-Tech: DR 40 front, DR 20 flanks. The armored car's HP are even close to your 100 HP estimate. It's armed with a Light Autocannon, you say? Well, let's pick… hmm. The Hughes M242 Bushmaster, same book. That's a 25mm autocannon, usually firing SAPHE-SD-T, for 6dx4 pi++ follow-up 3d+2 [1d+1] cr ex; RoF 3, 30 shots; 1/2D 2400 yards, Max 3300 yards. So, one Hunter fires a burst at the other, and scores one hit. Crack! An average hit on the front does… 84, minus 40 for 44, x1 for huge piercing, plus the follow-up explosion for 12 more. He's down to 44 hit points, damaged but not seriously so, yet. But if the piercing damage had done a few points more, this would have been "major damage", causing a vehicle system to malfunction. A near miss would do only the explosive burst damage and fragmentation—which this armor can shrug off easily. A lucky hit on the flank with all three rounds could do around 350 damage, knocking him to -250. HT roll or it's wrecked, major damage even if you make the roll, and from now on, HT rolls each second in operation to resist malfunction. (Eyeballing the tank cannon stats, I'd say a good tank could do this from the front in a single shot. Wham.) And a critical hit, of course, could blow it sky high. I note that there's no way you could really harm a proper tank with this armament… unless you fought like a Gear, using cover, getting close, and aiming for vulnerable points. Or used bombs or a Panzerfaust. I am probably way off on my memories of the Heavy Gear stats and descriptions, but that all feels pretty right to me for a one-on-one heavy gear duel, about the right level of risk to fit my mental image. Whether I've got the numbers right or not, the point is that doing it this way means you don't have to grind your way through some weapons formula unless there's some weapon that doesn't have a direct equivalent; you just start with work GURPS has already done for you, and tweak it to match. Another reason I say this is that some of your estimated numbers break my suspension of disbelief. A "light" autocannon that does damage like a 75mm tank gun carried by a mere 7-ton mecha with more armor protection than a WWII tank with five times its mass… well, no wonder they're either shrugging off all harm, or getting splattered like eggs! :) |
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Tags |
conversion, heavy gear, mecha |
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