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Old 07-15-2005, 11:18 AM   #1
Metaphysica
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Default Telekinesis Questions

I'm building a psychokinetic in 4e and I love the TK rules, and building the other powers I need is working out well, but I have some questions I thought you guys might be able to answer, or at least discuss.

So to use my TK I take a concentrate maneuver and then pick a maneuver for my TK, ie, ready to pick something up, attack to punch someone, move and attack to throw something.

1) Since I'm concentrating, if I use an active defense to, say dodge, I have to make a will-3 roll or lose concentration. But if my TK has taken a maneuver that allows it to defend (i.e. Attack) can it parry for me? Even if it was attacking a guy 20 yards away? I would think yes, assuming the attack could be parried. I think the limitations should be based on common sense, such as, if my TK is carryng something, I can either parry with the item, if the item is in between me and my attacker, or I can drop the item as a free action and parry with the TK itself.

2.) Comic books are filled with examples of telekinetics manipulating a great many objects at once. How can I buy the ability to manipulate more than one object at a time? The TK rules describe the TK as an invisible force that can manipulate items at a distance as if two hands were available. (Not a direct quote, don't have the book with me) so do I have two TK hands? ANd do the TK hands have to stay together? I see two ways of doing it, either allow small items up to the total lift capacity of the TK to be lifted and maneuvered as a group item, or just buy TK multiple times.

Now for building a power I was surprised GURPS doesn't have built in.

I want a force field power. The easiest way to do it is to buy DR and take the force field enhancement, which pretty much means I have a reflexive force field that appears around me whenever something hits me, which I like a lot. I also want a projectable force field that could be used to protect other things. My best thought on this is to buy DR with the enhancements Ranged, and Area. That works well, but DR has no rules for activation. I can make it cost fatigue, which is fine, but what I really want is to make it take concentration, like my other TK powers. I"ve looked through the limitations in the book and can't find anything which takes a power from being reflexive to Requires Concentration. Am I missing something or am I just going about this the wrong way?
My other thought was to buy Affliction, and have the Affliction give the advantage of DR, but that is problematic because it allows a resistance roll and is only really designed to work on characters, not simple spaces.

Ok, that's all for now, I'll probably still have to work this stuff out with my GM, but I thought you guys could give me some ideas.

Thanks a lot,
Meta
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Old 07-15-2005, 11:33 AM   #2
Der Wanderer
 
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Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

To control more than one thing with TK use Compartmentlized Mind (TK only)
For the projected Force Field use Innate Attack (Crushing, Wall), though unlike DR this is destructible...
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Old 07-15-2005, 11:37 AM   #3
vitruvian
 
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Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

Quote:
1) Since I'm concentrating, if I use an active defense to, say dodge, I have to make a will-3 roll or lose concentration. But if my TK has taken a maneuver that allows it to defend (i.e. Attack) can it parry for me? Even if it was attacking a guy 20 yards away? I would think yes, assuming the attack could be parried. I think the limitations should be based on common sense, such as, if my TK is carryng something, I can either parry with the item, if the item is in between me and my attacker, or I can drop the item as a free action and parry with the TK itself.
Hmm... I'd say you could parry/block with whatever object you have picked up, so long as it was within your TK Move range of the path between you and the attacker. I'm not sure that you can parry 'with the TK itself' the same way you can strike with it.

Quote:
2.) Comic books are filled with examples of telekinetics manipulating a great many objects at once. How can I buy the ability to manipulate more than one object at a time? The TK rules describe the TK as an invisible force that can manipulate items at a distance as if two hands were available. (Not a direct quote, don't have the book with me) so do I have two TK hands? ANd do the TK hands have to stay together? I see two ways of doing it, either allow small items up to the total lift capacity of the TK to be lifted and maneuvered as a group item, or just buy TK multiple times.
The best way to do this is not to buy the TK multiple times, but to get levels of Compartmentalized Mind to concentrate on multiple objects with (possibly slightly limited to only work for controlling TK). This could also allow you to run around not having to concentrate and able to dodge with your 'first' mind while your additional minds control the TK.

I probably wouldn't let you split the 'hands' without this. Other options might be Extra Attacks or allowing you to take TK with Area Effect and Selective Effect, which ends up being pretty expensive, while still requiring rolls to hit or lift individual objects within the area.


Quote:
I want a force field power. The easiest way to do it is to buy DR and take the force field enhancement, which pretty much means I have a reflexive force field that appears around me whenever something hits me, which I like a lot. I also want a projectable force field that could be used to protect other things. My best thought on this is to buy DR with the enhancements Ranged, and Area. That works well, but DR has no rules for activation. I can make it cost fatigue, which is fine, but what I really want is to make it take concentration, like my other TK powers. I"ve looked through the limitations in the book and can't find anything which takes a power from being reflexive to Requires Concentration. Am I missing something or am I just going about this the wrong way?
My other thought was to buy Affliction, and have the Affliction give the advantage of DR, but that is problematic because it allows a resistance roll and is only really designed to work on characters, not simple spaces.
I would let you do this with enhancements on DR (Force Field, Area, Ranged) myself, since the description of the Force Field enhancement says it protects things you're holding within the field, but I believe Powers is going to say an additional 'Usable on Others' enhancement will be needed for the DR to actually benefit anyone else. However, the canon way to do this is to get an Innate Attack with the Wall enhancement and put up a 'wall of force'.

As for the appropriate limitation to make the power Require Concentration, I'm not sure of a canonical answer, but it could probably be handled as an Accessibility of at least -20% to -30%, depending on how harshly you want to enforce all the strictures of the Concentration maneuver.
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Old 07-16-2005, 10:50 AM   #4
Metaphysica
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

Thanks for the thoughts guys, the innate attack wall thing isn't something I'd thought of, actually the ablative nature would allow a force field that people could eventually smash through, whereas DR would be a forcefield that had to be penetrated all at once. I'll have to decide which way I want it to work.

I spoke to my GM yesterday about the multiple maneuvers thing, and we decided to buy multiple instances of TK with the linked advantage, then, since activating one would activate all of them, I could lift several objects at once or I could add all the TK's on one object and lift a heavier object. Since I wouldn't have separate actions, they would all have to do pretty much the same thing. As an example, pick up 3 wrenches and 2 screwdrivers from a toolbox (one Ready maneuver) then next turn throw the tools at the bad guy (one Move and attack Maneuver).

Your way would be more expensive, but would allow be to do totally separate things with the TK, which is pretty cool. But would I still need to buy multiple instances of TK? I can see it both ways. Compartmentalized Mind says each compartment has all your mental abilities, but it also describes taking two concentrate maneuvers to concentrate on DIFFERENT spells, but implies (and this is how I ruled it when I GM'd a mage with Compartmentalized Mind) that you can't concentrate for two seconds worth on one spell. Maybe the question is whether or not controlling TK requires concentration, or if it requires 1 second of concentration like spells.

Looking forward to your thoughts,
-Meta
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Old 07-16-2005, 12:05 PM   #5
Ze'Manel Cunha
 
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Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metahysica
I can make it cost fatigue, which is fine, but what I really want is to make it take concentration, like my other TK powers. I"ve looked through the limitations in the book and can't find anything which takes a power from being reflexive to Requires Concentration. Am I missing something or am I just going about this the wrong way?
One level of Takes Extra Time, -10%, will do exactly that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metaphysica
But would I still need to buy multiple instances of TK?
Depending on what you want to do, yes, but don't worry, Alternate Attacks/Abilities/Powers are your friend.

BTW, if you have a couple of minutes, and want to see a few examples, try clicking on the following threads*:

Low Level Psionicists
PK as Innate Attack
Powers question
Aura vs Attack
Attempted FAQ for Psi
Medium Power Psi
Psionic Talents & Skill Limitation
Telesend Power - is this right?

[*While I was at it, I used this opportunity to archive somewhat some of the psi questions, so thanks.]
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Old 07-16-2005, 02:56 PM   #6
smurf
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Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

I would also wait for gurps powers. As its not possible to convert some 3rd ed to 4 ed without going into silly points. And thats with cutting back the skills to the bones, even reducing psi talents!

So build a basic model but be prepared to adapt it later. Still waiting grrr.
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Old 07-17-2005, 09:39 AM   #7
Mehmet
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Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

I think, if your character has some "material sense" of some sorts, enabling him to feel the presence of material that may be manipulated using TK, he should be able to divide his TK "strength" and, for instance, throw ten 1/5 lbs stones (for TK 10) at a single target ;)

Cheerz...
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Old 07-18-2005, 10:16 AM   #8
vitruvian
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Re: Telekinesis Questions

Quote:
Your way would be more expensive, but would allow be to do totally separate things with the TK, which is pretty cool. But would I still need to buy multiple instances of TK? I can see it both ways. Compartmentalized Mind says each compartment has all your mental abilities, but it also describes taking two concentrate maneuvers to concentrate on DIFFERENT spells, but implies (and this is how I ruled it when I GM'd a mage with Compartmentalized Mind) that you can't concentrate for two seconds worth on one spell.
Each mind has all your mental abilities, so each can concentrate on the exact same spell, or the exact same ability such as TK. I wouldn't require buying TK twice, although I might restrict total weight lifted between the 'minds'. The only thing CM would *not* let you do is concentrate for two seconds worth on the same *instance* of the same spell that takes longer to cast - you can't make it work like Altered Time Rate, which is twice as costly.

Say you have an ability (spell, advantage, doesn't matter) that takes 2 seconds to activate or cast. With Altered Time Rate, you can do this in one turn and then get on with your life. With Compartmentalized Mind, you can have one mind start the process, while your other controls your body for combat or uses another mental ability, but it will still take the full 2 seconds.

Quote:
Maybe the question is whether or not controlling TK requires concentration, or if it requires 1 second of concentration like spells.
I think it requires the Concentrate maneuver each turn that you are using it, and then the TK 'hands' get to take your chosen maneuver. CM therefore is perfect for the character that moves around, dodges, blocks punches, etc. normally while using TK, since one mind can just constantly concentrate while the other handles other things at no penalty.
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