01-23-2017, 08:55 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Midwest, USA
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[RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Rules as written and canonically speaking—and I think I've had this answer before but forgotten—what do the rules state in regard to knockback after a character's shield is struck?
For example, does an elf suffer knockback if a ST 30 troll hits his shield with a maul? I understand that in DF, there is no knockback to a character who successfully blocked, but this question isn't specific to DF. Seeking rules quotes with page references. Thanks!
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01-23-2017, 09:36 PM | #2 |
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Northern Virginia, USA
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
B484, Damage to Shields. (Optional rule)
"If your shield’s DB makes the difference between success and fail- ure on any active defense (not just a block), the blow struck the shield squarely, and may damage it. Apply the attack’s damage to the shield. Subtract the shield’s DR. If no damage penetrates the shield, there is no effect . . . but you experience full knockback!" |
01-23-2017, 09:43 PM | #3 |
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Midwest, USA
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
There's the rules! Thanks!
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. "How the heck am I supposed to justify that whatever I feel like doing at any particular moment is 'in character' if I can't say 'I'm chaotic evil!'"? —Jeff Freeman |
01-24-2017, 01:41 AM | #4 |
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Land of the Beer, Home of the Dirndls
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
As this came up in my last session, where does the retreat bonus come in here? Let's say I've got Block 9, a large shield and retreat. I ruled it as:
3-9: (Raw block) Evaded or deflected without undue contact. 10-11: (Shield) Potential damage to shield 12: (Retreat) Barely missed. |
01-24-2017, 05:32 AM | #5 | |
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ellicott City, MD
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Quote:
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01-24-2017, 06:28 AM | #6 | |
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Australia WA
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Quote:
If it's just for flavour (as I don't recall any special effect happening if you make your dodge by the Retreat bonus, but I've been known to forget rules), then I would apply the Shield's DB after the Retreat, so 11-12 would damage the shield. |
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01-24-2017, 07:18 AM | #7 | |
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Land of the Beer, Home of the Dirndls
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Quote:
Any RAW and/or logical reason for the order? My line of thinking was that for a block, it always uses the shield, so the retreat is technically the "last add-on". Not too passionate about that, though ;) |
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01-24-2017, 07:37 AM | #8 | |
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Quote:
That's how I have my Players do it anyway. |
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01-24-2017, 11:56 AM | #9 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
Just to throw in my two cents, without any confidence that my view is better, I do it like mhd: I say that the lowest numbers in the "block" score represent skill, which is always present; the next numbers are the DB, which is an add-on (due to the shield) but is always there in some form (since hey, you're blocking, so you must have a shield); and the last number is the retreat bonus (which comes and goes pretty freely depending on the situation).
Somehow it just makes sense to me to add the retreat bonus last, since it's the one that applies least consistently. I think somehow my mind thinks about the block score as a physical pile of numbers, and then assumes that the retreat bonus ought be to on top so as to remain accessible, since it gets added and then taken away again so often.... Clearly there's no necessity for this; it's just what makes sense to me.
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01-24-2017, 12:46 PM | #10 |
Join Date: Apr 2015
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Re: [RAW] Knockback Against Shields?
I always apply the shield DB last. It's the only thing that has an effect other than "It doesn't hit you.", so it should be the defense of last resort. Otherwise you'll have situations where your DB 3 shield gets hit, takes a lot of damage, and blows through to your torso when a DB 0 shield would have avoided the attack completely. That doesn't pass the sanity check for me.
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