Building an Heir

[SenorPez]

What would be the appropriate template for the heir of a noble house. I've seen a few opinions on how to build it, and was looking for opinions both on the rules but on how it might affect the roleplaying of said character.

The general social concept looks something like this:

• TL3
• Age of majority; not a child but still young.
• Rural village with mostly ordinary people, but a few noble houses.
• Heir to the noble house, but his house isn't the one in power as the mayor.

Advantages

• Legal Immunity 1 [5]
• Patrons (House Gray) (15 or less) [30]
• Status (None) (Heir (+2)) [5] Status 1 for now, goes to 2 upon ascension.
• Wealth (Average) (Heir (Comfortable)) [5] Average wealth, presumably an allowance, goes to Comfortable upon ascension.

Disadvantages

• Code of Honor (Feudal) [-10]
• Duty (House Gray) (12 or less) [-10]
• Enemy (House Blue) (Small group) (9 or less, Rival) [-5]

Most of the heir's starting equipment would be from the Patron. He doesn't "own" it, so not worth the extra advantage points, but the Patron isn't about to let his heir go out with rusty sword and battered leather armour.

Likewise, I don't feel like Dead Broke is an appropriate disadvantage for someone who's already an adult (for a child, yes), as, again, the Patron might almost expect his heir to be out spending money in the community and making his own investments.

Thoughts?

Are there other disadvantages he should have?
Is the Heir modifier the correct for the advantages, since it's a future advantage?

Thanks!

[Phantasm]

If he's getting an allowance of sorts from the House, I'd add Independent Income, at least enough to cover CoL and replacement sundries.

Other than that, I think you've covered everything. (Yes, Heir is the proper modifier on his Wealth and Status.)

[NineDaysDead]

Comfortable wealth is pretty poor for a Noble!

[Anaraxes]

Status 2 is low for "noble". The actual status hierarchy will depend on the setting, so it's up to the GM. But 2 is usually "knight" in a typical pseudo-European-medieval setting, not even reaching nobility. It's also the level for upper middle class in modern settings. "Noble" usually starts at 4. (See the chart on B265.)

If the character can actually command the House to do anything for him, he'd also need Rank. (For feudal societies, Social Engineering recommends merging Status and Rank into a single "Feudal Rank" Advantage, so they always match.)

You can, of course, come up with rationales for not spending so much. For example, it's an old, toppled house that lost its influence, so it's really just Courtesy Rank and doesn't have the proper amount of Status the title would suggest.

Unless the campaign is highly social and involves a lot of organizations, as opposed to individual action-adventure heroics, the CP it takes to build a proper noble probably aren't going to be worth it. A lot of groups would find it odd or just uninteresting to have a character that sits back home in the castle pulling strings and ordering his minions to do all the dungeon-crawling for him.

[NineDaysDead]

To put the wealth in perspective, does he own a horse? A Cavalry Horse ($4,000) or Heavy Warhorse ($5,000) alone would require Wealthy (base wealth X5) [20] at TL3 (base wealth $1,000). And that would eat up all his starting cash. I'd be thinking Filthy Rich [50], remembering to spend at least 80% of his starting wealth on non-adventuring stuff.

[SenorPez]

The player I'm trying to help along is kind of wanting a 'fish out of water' concept, so being useless in the dungeon, but useful in town, is kind of the result, given the points we're building at.

I've been pondering the effects of Dead Broke. Honestly, the interaction between Wealth, Status, Rank, and Independent Income is one of the "character shaping" facets I enjoy about GURPS. The thought is that the heir doesn't actually own anything, no more than I owned mostly-nothing at 16. For example, my parents owned my car but let me use it. The gas money for it came out of my allowance (and later, the service-industry job I got).

Similarly, yes, the heir would have a horse, but it's probably not his.

We'll continue to iterate... and see what might be more fun... continuing on this concept, or "softening" it to a well-to-do townsfolker.

Comments and insights continue to be welcome! Thanks!

[Dragondog]

Worminghall has a solution for the wealth aspect of this. The young person's Wealth level represents the resources of his family, not personal wealth.

The young person has starting money equal to 20% and 20% of typical monthly pay for their Wealth level as support from his family. (See page 7 of the above title.)

Another option is to give the Patron the Equipment enhancement. Unless all of his adventuring is on assignment from his house, he needs it to take that horse you mentioned with him to do other things.

[Donny Brook]

Originally Posted by NineDaysDead

To put the wealth in perspective, does he own a horse? A Cavalry Horse ($4,000) or Heavy Warhorse ($5,000) alone would require Wealthy (base wealth X5) [20] at TL3 (base wealth $1,000). And that would eat up all his starting cash. I'd be thinking Filthy Rich [50], remembering to spend at least 80% of his starting wealth on non-adventuring stuff.

The 80/20 split is not a rule of universal application, so check with the GM. Also, it is typiically recommended as a replacement for actually buying all the usual impedimenta of normal life, so he doesn't really need to actively spend the 80%. It is just assumed to be spent on the starting allotment of Cost of Living stuff.

Originally Posted by Anaraxes

Status 2 is low for "noble". The actual status hierarchy will depend on the setting, so it's up to the GM. But 2 is usually "knight" in a typical pseudo-European-medieval setting, not even reaching nobility. It's also the level for upper middle class in modern settings. "Noble" usually starts at 4. (See the chart on B265.)

My understaning is that Knights at status 2 are "noble" in the sense of enjoying the social privileges denied to 'commoners'. In modern settings, Status 1 is upper middle class, e.g. members of the 'professions' (physicians, barristers,...)

[Whyte]

Just to point out quickly... A "rural village" would not support a noble family (save perhaps a knightly family), let alone a noble house (extended family with cousins at least, all noble), and certainly not many of them. You need a big, wealthy city (+ hinterlands) like the Italian city states to get 'rival houses'. Heck, even a mayor is a stretch for a TL3 rural village.

I am assuming historical medieval society of course, which I understand might not be correct for a Dungeon Fantasy setting. I could imagine a larger proportion of population not being peasants with the Bless Plants and such spells around. Still, I think the setting would be better if it were larger. Like have one bigger town, with the noble houses having their lands around the city, and the houses playing musical chairs with the mayorship.

[Michele]

Originally Posted by Whyte

Just to point out quickly... A "rural village" would not support a noble family (save perhaps a knightly family), let alone a noble house (extended family with cousins at least, all noble), and certainly not many of them. You need a big, wealthy city (+ hinterlands) like the Italian city states to get 'rival houses'. Heck, even a mayor is a stretch for a TL3 rural village.

I am assuming historical medieval society of course, which I understand might not be correct for a Dungeon Fantasy setting. I could imagine a larger proportion of population not being peasants with the Bless Plants and such spells around. Still, I think the setting would be better if it were larger. Like have one bigger town, with the noble houses having their lands around the city, and the houses playing musical chairs with the mayorship.

I agree. The alternative would be at least a small/medium town, in which, however, the Grays are the top dogs (they'll have knights at least, or lesser nobles, owing fealty to them, but no rivals). The rival house, the Blues, may well have its home in the nearest other town of similar size.
The encounters will be less frequent, of course. But they might be rivals when meeting in the higher noble family's city (when attending the Duke's banquets, tournaments etc.), or while hunting along the border area. Another interesting point of attrition is the band of brigands who have their base in the Blues' county, but are clever enough to carry out their crimes in the Grays' county. Being upstream and downstream the same river also creates problems, or having market town rights that are in competition, etc.