Orichalcum Wolverine

[Flyndaran]

Originally Posted by The_Ryujin

I can never understand this all or nothing mind set, just because you want to add some fantastic concepts to your campaign doesn't mean that you want to throw all reality out the window.

Fiction, no matter how realistic, is ultimately about "what if".

...
Also since your muscles now have a much higher tensile strength your strength should be much higher as well.... though figuring how much is a bit more complicated heh.

Of course, but a simple "it's not realistic" isn't useful for discussions that don't involve "real-reality". One needs to specify which aspects of a setting are and are not bound by our physics.
I love taking one or two aspects of super-science and/or full out magic and keeping everything else real world mundane.

Metal does not have to be stronger than flesh in a gurps stat definition at all. Aluminum siding has zero Strength after all. It just sits there.

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by The_Ryujin

Well assuming he'd be 150lbs as a human he would have a DR of about 311, or at lest give a cover DR of that much. If you go by the rules for damaging armor in Low-Tech he would only protected himself with about 90% of his actual DR or 280. Of course he would also now weight 1305lbs so... be sure to inspect the structural quality of any building you want to enter....

Also since your muscles now have a much higher tensile strength your strength should be much higher as well.... though figuring how much is a bit more complicated heh.

Originally Posted by Bruno

My back of the envelope scratchings suggests ST between 22 ("realistic" end) to 34 ("cinematic" end). As a Homogenous entity, HP should be 4x that, AND you take Injury Tolerance (Homogenous).

Magic and powers are every day things in the setting, so, 30 sounds good =)

Originally Posted by starslayer

As a GM I would not allow that type of wish wahness on the rules. Wish can grant 25 points of advantages, you are trying to grant yourself and advantage. (Or I would let it happen, but not tell your about the side effects. you get your 75 points of Dr It also comes with a cosmic terminally ill, dx -4 constant agony, and iq -2)

Procedure is being done with tech, and such side effects are the results of failed rolls. Your insistence on saying that Wish dictating that a 3 is rolled gives me the effects of failures is a terrible thing for a GM to do. I have gone through the effort of finding the material and the people, and am only using the Wish to avoid any chance of failure.

[Nereidalbel]

OK, GM and I agree that 280 DR is a bit much. If skin, muscle, and bone are replaced and the internal organs remain soft and fleshy (basically being IT:Unliving), what sort of DR would that end up with?

[Dingle]

Isn't Injury Tolerance: unliving the opposite of that.
Internal organs aren't valuable, but structural stuff is vulnerable.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

OK, GM and I agree that 280 DR is a bit much. If skin, muscle, and bone are replaced and the internal organs remain soft and fleshy (basically being IT:Unliving), what sort of DR would that end up with?

The cutis (epidermis + dermis) is around 0.05" thick, which would give you DR 10 (Orichalcum is DR 204/inch). The hypodermis (fat reserves, blood vessels, nerves, and connection to underlying muscle and bone) typically has similar thickness IIRC, so that would be a further DR 10. Muscle would depend on your ST. Your muscles should normally provide around 0.6xST* Cover DR to those behind you, so you would get about half of that yourself, or 0.3xST. Muscle probably provides around DR 2 per inch, so multiply this value by 102. Total will be around 30xST. Bone is a bit more iffy, but using the same methodology as for muscle (but noting that living bone is probably around DR 12/inch) we can go with 14% of body mass working out to 1.19xST. Note these use your ST before the replacement, not after.

Once you've figured out how much of your body is being replaced with Orichalcum, determine what effect this has on your weight. Orichalcum is going to be around 7x as dense as whatever you're replacing. Skin is around 16% of body weight (it's probably close enough to have a 50/50 split between cutis and hypodermis/subcutaneous tissues), muscle is around 60%, and bone is around 14%. Figure out this value, multiply by 6, and add it back to your original body weight. You can then use the cube root of your post vs pre body weight ratio as a multiplier to determine what effect this has on your ST and HP. However much your HP increases, subtract this from the actual DR you gained from turning your body into Orichalcum.

For example, let's take a 200 lb, ST 14 character. Replacing his entire skin gives +20 DR and +192 lb, replacing his muscles gives +420 DR and +720 lb, and replacing his skeleton gives +16 DR and +168 lb. Altogether, that would make the character 1280 lb, or 6.4x his previous weight. The cube root of 6.4 is around 1.85, so multiply 14 by this - the character's new ST is 26. That means we've added 12 HP, so we subtract this from the Orichalcum DR, for a final value of +444 DR.
That's obviously a bit much. I'd say you should replace the cutis and skeleton outright, but only augment the muscles a bit. The cutis is +10 DR and +96 lb, the skeleton is +16 DR and +168 lb. Replacing enough of the muscles for +24 DR is only around +41 lb. That makes your character 505 lb, ST 19. Total DR is +45, once we account for the increased HP.

*Average people are around 55% muscle, weight lifters are around 65% muscle, so I split the difference. The cube root function might need to be accounted for, but that's optional.

[T.K.]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

OK, GM and I agree that 280 DR is a bit much. If skin, muscle, and bone are replaced and the internal organs remain soft and fleshy (basically being IT:Unliving), what sort of DR would that end up with?

Well, you didn't give much info on the setting to actually be able to ballpark what a meaningful but not brokenly op Wish could be.

As a GM, I'm on the front that if you allowed the possibility of a Wish to be sought after and the players actually managed to pull it off, they deserve a meaningful payoff aka I'd be really ****** with the @starslayer guy method of kneejerking the Wish with a helluva of disads >.>

That said, it'll be heavily dependant on the setting overall power level:

A Fantasy setting that tries to keep equipment/armor relevant might find 30-40 DR to be really high while a supers setting might find 100 DR "no problem!" level.
What's the campaign pts level? Is the GM going to use the Wish opportunity to uplift the points level? (I like to do this from time to time...1 player unlocks a new point level cap, going far above the rest of the players which in turn unlocks the potential for the other players to find ways to also make that jump, taking the campaign level to that new plateau)

Lastly, I don't believe IT:Unliving quite depict your description, as already stated.
If you want to do as you said, having only tissues, skins and alike covered with Orichalcum while still possessing pulsing fleshy organs I'd do something along the lines of:

IT:Homogenous (Has Vitals; Has Brain) 30 pts - So you basically get the damage reduction for types of damage, but can also suffer targeted attacks on the specific parts for extra damage.

Just to add...I don't believe such process should leave your organs uncovered by Orichalcum...so I'd go with full Homogenous were I the GM.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by T.K.

Lastly, I don't believe IT:Unliving quite depict your description, as already stated.

I forgot to address this in my previous post, but IT: Unliving or Homogenous really doesn't fit here. The character is still a complex "machine" (hence homogenous is inappropriate) and still has fully functioning living tissue (hence Unliving is inappropriate). Something like Armored Flesh would be most appropriate, but could be a bit hairy to implement (and with orichalcum being around 200x as effective as flesh, would probably be too much of a bonus), so just increasing DR (and ST/HP) seems the most appropriate thing to do here.

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by T.K.

Well, you didn't give much info on the setting to actually be able to ballpark what a meaningful but not brokenly op Wish could be.

As a GM, I'm on the front that if you allowed the possibility of a Wish to be sought after and the players actually managed to pull it off, they deserve a meaningful payoff aka I'd be really ****** with the @starslayer guy method of kneejerking the Wish with a helluva of disads >.>

Current DR values range from 30-60. So, suddenly jumping to 280 would put me in the range of "either I'm invincible, or, everybody else turns into a fine, red mist in one shot." Starslayer would anger me considerably, given that I went through the effort of finding a Wish, collecting all that orichalcum, and finding somebody who could have an effective skill of 3 for the Wish to even be usable.

That said, point totals mean nothing, as it's entirely how you spend them that matters. We'll regularly have point gaps of 200-500, and the only difference in effectiveness is how well they're used. Mr. 35 skill in Short Sword doesn't even know what Deceptive Attack is, so, his attacks are dodged far too often.

[T.K.]

Originally Posted by Nereidalbel

Current DR values range from 30-60. So, suddenly jumping to 280 would put me in the range of "either I'm invincible, or, everybody else turns into a fine, red mist in one shot." Starslayer would anger me considerably, given that I went through the effort of finding a Wish, collecting all that orichalcum, and finding somebody who could have an effective skill of 3 for the Wish to even be usable.

That said, point totals mean nothing, as it's entirely how you spend them that matters. We'll regularly have point gaps of 200-500, and the only difference in effectiveness is how well they're used. Mr. 35 skill in Short Sword doesn't even know what Deceptive Attack is, so, his attacks are dodged far too often.

May I ask what was your Wish wording, actually? Were I the GM that would swing the effects quite a bit...not really in the sense of how powerful the reward you'd get but what type of modifications

[Nereidalbel]

Originally Posted by T.K.

May I ask what was your Wish wording, actually? Were I the GM that would swing the effects quite a bit...not really in the sense of how powerful the reward you'd get but what type of modifications

I'm just using the basic "dictate the result of a die roll" to get a 3 on the procedure itself. The hard part is just how much ST/HP/DR I can gain, with the critical success nixing any chance of horrible side effects.