Spell Stones or Manastones and Create Object

[MEC]

I have a struggling mage that has some enchanting capacity, but few resources to gather gems, cast spells them, just to have them destroyed. So far, I can’t find any discussions on using the Create Objet spell to make items to use Manastone, Spell Stone, or any other spell that requires a material of X value. Anyone see any issues with this (other than the obvious fact that if the item is dropped or other otherwise away from a living being the item and thus the enchantment will go away)?

[vierasmarius]

I would not allow this. In general, the material requirements for magic simply can't be fulfilled with more magic.

[mlangsdorf]

I don't see a problem with it. Using Create Object to create gemstone that is then incorporated in a magic item that the caster has to carry with him at all times seems like a fairly large draw back. If the caster drops the object or puts it down for any reason, the gemstone disappears and the enchantment is lost.

For anyone who can cast reasonable enchantments, it's almost certainly better to earn some actual money and buy the appropriate components than try to create them via Create Object.

[MEC]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

I would not allow this. In general, the material requirements for magic simply can't be fulfilled with more magic.

So I assume in your campaigns then, that Wizard Alchemists can't use their magical abilities to reduce the cost or time for making their magical elixirs?

[Anthony]

Object created with create object have zero value (or value equal to the cost to cast), as they are not persistent.

[Kuroshima]

I would allow it, but it would count as an item of 0 value (so you get the same results as enchanting a random pebble), and with the same restrictions as Create Object (vulnerability to dispel, to no mana zones, to not being in contact with a living being...)

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by MEC

So I assume in your campaigns then, that Wizard Alchemists can't use their magical abilities to reduce the cost or time for making their magical elixirs?

They can, but not by pulling alchemical ingredients out of thin air.

[MEC]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

They can, but not by pulling alchemical ingredients out of thin air.

But wouldn't that be what using Essential Acid or Essential Earth (per example in Magic p211) are doing?

[MEC]

Originally Posted by Kuroshima

I would allow it, but it would count as an item of 0 value (so you get the same results as enchanting a random pebble), and with the same restrictions as Create Object (vulnerability to dispel, to no mana zones, to not being in contact with a living being...)

I guess this is where my problem with it being based on value comes in. I've assumed the value was just a convenient way to describe a gem of certain size (though yes it does appear you can take a painting and turn it into a powerstone). But if it truly the value of the item that is the basis of whether it can be enchanted or not, then are there great fluctuations just based on non-game mechanic items. For example the painting idea. Last year, I buy a painting that is valued at $1000 and build up the powerstone enchantment on it to near max. Suddenly that painter is out of favor and no one will buy his works and the value plummets to $50. Now do I have to divide the amount of power by 4 as it is enchanted over the value?

Also if I walk into a cave that has gems lying everywhere, or use plane shift to get to a plane where gems are more common than dirt, the character can pick up the "valued" items and bring them back without having to earn the money needed to by the ingredients. Is that any different than using Create Object and being limited by the restrictions of a created object?