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Old 12-12-2018, 08:37 PM   #1
hcobb
 
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Pacheco, California
Default Summon flamming sword!

Wizard casts Illusion of a flaming sword into his hand because he never learned the Staff spell.

So I have a few questions for house ruling...
  1. Does he need the Sword skill to use it?
  2. Does it light up his environment, like a torch?
  3. Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
  4. Does it interfere with his spell casting? (What if he says it's an illusion of a flaming sword staff?)
  5. If it appears to be iron rather than silver does it inflict the -4 DX on his spellcasting?
  6. If somebody grabs it from him can he will it away?
  7. And why isn't there a Summon Weapon spell?
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Old 12-12-2018, 09:38 PM   #2
platimus
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
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Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Wizard casts Illusion of a flaming sword into his hand because he never learned the Staff spell.

So I have a few questions for house ruling...
  1. Does he need the Sword skill to use it?
  2. Does it light up his environment, like a torch?
  3. Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
  4. Does it interfere with his spell casting? (What if he says it's an illusion of a flaming sword staff?)
  5. If it appears to be iron rather than silver does it inflict the -4 DX on his spellcasting?
  6. If somebody grabs it from him can he will it away?
  7. And why isn't there a Summon Weapon spell?
1. No
2. Not for him. He knows it's an illusion. For everyone else, it depends on the hex-size illusion the wizard chose to create.
3. Yes.
4. No. Doesn't matter what type of weapon it is.
5. No
6. Yes, but observers get a bonus to disbelief attempts.
7. There is. It's called Illusion! :P
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Last edited by platimus; 12-13-2018 at 07:48 AM.
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Old 12-13-2018, 01:29 AM   #3
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

My house rulings:

0) You can't cast an illusion of a magic item to get illusory magic powers. So you can make a sword illusion, but not a flaming sword illusion... with the possible exception if your foes know you have a specific actual magic sword.

1) Does he need the Sword skill to use it?
Yes, or no but at -4.

2) Does it light up his environment, like a torch?
No. You can't create an illusion of an active light source in a dark place.

3) Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
If you ignore 0), yes.

4) Does it interfere with his spell casting?
Yes

4b) (What if he says it's an illusion of a flaming sword staff?)
Again, no illusions of arbitrarily-enchanted items. You can't have a staff sword illusion and more than you can have an illusion of an item with 5 powerful self-powered enchantments so you can spam those on your foes.

But maybe if the enemies all know you do have an actual sword staff, you can make an illusion of that one. Or you can cast Staff on the sword illusion if you want...


5) If it appears to be iron rather than silver does it inflict the -4 DX on his spellcasting?
Yes.

6) If somebody grabs it from him can he will it away?
Yes.

7) And why isn't there a Summon Weapon spell?
Because there isn't, perhaps because it's not so great - you can summon a Myrmidon, which is better. There is one in GURPS, and in TFT campaigns where someone manages to research one.
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Old 12-21-2018, 09:27 PM   #4
Helborn
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skarg View Post
3) Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
If you ignore 0), yes.
NO
The troll THINKS it is unhealable fire damage and falls down when the damage is enough to kill it/render it unconscious, but then eventually wakes up healed (to whatever level the GM says) since the damage is in the mind but the healing is in the body
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Old 07-03-2019, 02:33 AM   #5
Tywyll
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Wizard casts Illusion of a flaming sword into his hand because he never learned the Staff spell.
Based on how you can only create illusions of 'base' objects unless under special circumstances, I would say this would be outside your capabilities.

Quote:
So I have a few questions for house ruling...
  1. Does he need the Sword skill to use it?
  1. If he's going to fight with it, yes. Otherwise its just holding a piece of metal. He can't adequately threaten someone with it if he doesn't know how.

    Quote:
  2. Does it light up his environment, like a torch?
  3. Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
  4. As described below. No to him, yes to others (though he couldn't have a flaming sword normally).

    I would argue maybe...depends on how you see the regeneration working. However, as soon as the troll 'passed out' from damage it would reactivate because they come back from 'death' all the time and the damage is psycho-somatic.

    Quote:
  5. Does it interfere with his spell casting? (What if he says it's an illusion of a flaming sword staff?)
  6. If it appears to be iron rather than silver does it inflict the -4 DX on his spellcasting?
  7. If somebody grabs it from him can he will it away?
  8. And why isn't there a Summon Weapon spell?
No.
No
Yes, why couldn't he?
Didn't you make one?
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Old 07-03-2019, 04:30 AM   #6
RobW
 
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Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

I miss hcobb
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Old 07-03-2019, 05:48 AM   #7
Tywyll
 
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I miss hcobb
What happened to him?
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Old 07-03-2019, 11:33 AM   #8
MikMod
 
Join Date: May 2019
Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Wizard casts Illusion of a flaming sword into his hand because he never learned the Staff spell.

So I have a few questions for house ruling...
Interesting! My personal take on illusions is that the caster also needs to 'believe' in the illusion, or it will unravel - it is a mental contortion. Also damage is in the body, albeit caused by the mind.

Quote:
  1. Does he need the Sword skill to use it?
  1. It 'is' a sword, so yeah. If he doesn't have sword talent he will be at -4 DX.

    Quote:
  2. Does it light up his environment, like a torch?
  3. People, including the spellcaster certainly think it does, so they will perceive an environment 'lit' by the flame. But what will be revealed by its light? Only stuff you know is there already, or imagine to be there - so I would expect some very weird effects if you are using it as a torch.

    Quote:
  4. Does it inflict non-healing damage to trolls?
  5. Illusions inflict real damage - so yup. Flame damage does not regenerate.

    Quote:
  6. Does it interfere with his spell casting? (What if he says it's an illusion of a flaming sword staff?)
  7. Part 1: He has to think so to maintain the illusion, and that's enough to give him the penalty.

    Part 2 is hard to answer. If the spellcaster believes it is a staff sword then perhaps that is enough. Other people may not see it as a staff, but that won't matter to the wizard, in the same way that the light cast might reveal different things 'in the dark' to different observers.

    Quote:
  8. If it appears to be iron rather than silver does it inflict the -4 DX on his spellcasting?
  9. Of course. That's what iron does!

    Quote:
  10. If somebody grabs it from him can he will it away?
  11. Yes, just like any illusion. The wizard must both believe it to be real, and know that it is an illusion at the same time.

    Quote:
  12. And why isn't there a Summon Weapon spell?
No idea. :) I think my understanding of summoning is even poorer than my grasp of illusions!
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Old 07-03-2019, 01:30 PM   #9
RobW
 
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Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

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What happened to him [hcobb]?
I don't know -- seems to have disappeared kind of suddenly?
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Old 07-03-2019, 05:41 PM   #10
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Summon flamming sword!

Hcobb is still posting on the Facebook TFT group.
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