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Old 07-12-2018, 05:02 PM   #11
tbeard1999
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Tyler, Texas
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

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Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
Long story short: as I demonstrate the game to new people, I begin to feel that the current rule (3/DX roll to remain standing if you enter a hex with a fallen character) is annoying and reduces the fluidity of combat.

Would it be overreaction to strike it completely? I could turn it into a DX+4 or so roll, so you USUALLY don't fall down. Or I could just nuke it, and let the players dance freely among the bodies.

If you give me a howitzer on this, make it short and explain why it will speed play.
How about making them pay an extra movement point or some such?

Unnecessary flourish would be to allow them to make a 3/DX roll and jump over the hex (spending only 1 mp). Failure means you fall down.
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Old 07-12-2018, 05:39 PM   #12
luguvalium
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

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Originally Posted by Rick_Smith View Post
Hi Steve,
I wrote a page of rules which organized standing on bodies, jumping over bodies and jumping over anything. I ended up saying that being on bodies was treated as rough ground, but if you spent 3 MA moving onto them you didn't have to roll vs DX to stay standing.

Warm regards, Rick.
I like having bodies to avoid in combat, but I also see how that could be ignored for people just beginning to understand Melee. I'm in favor for it for ITL, but maybe an optional rule for Melee and Wizard.

I looked up what it stated in Advanced Melee p6: Jumping over a prone character is 3MA and 3d6/adjDX. Rick's suggestion seems reasonable that is 3MA to carefully step over a body or 3d6/adjDX to jump over.
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Old 07-12-2018, 05:47 PM   #13
pyratejohn
 
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Columbia, Maryland
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

Advanced Melee says "A figure may move into a hex with a fallen, unconscious or dead figure and stop. A figure may also jump over a fallen, unconscious or dead figure at a cost of 3 from its MA that turn. Whenever a figure enters a hex with a fallen figure of the same size or larger, it must make a saving roll on 3 dice vs. DX. If it misses the roll, it falls down in that hex."

IF you wanted a minor change you could do this. "A figure may move into a hex with a fallen, unconscious or dead figure and stop, suffering no penalty. A figure may jump over a fallen, unconscious or dead figure at a cost of 3 from its MA that turn. Should a figure choose to move through a hex with a fallen figure of the same size or larger, it must make a saving roll on 3 dice vs. DX. If it misses the roll, it falls down in that hex."
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Old 07-12-2018, 05:59 PM   #14
Dave Crowell
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

I would vote to keep some rule for a fallen body in a hex causing an impediment.

Pyratejohn's suggested wording in the post directly above seems quite reasonable to me.
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Old 07-12-2018, 06:02 PM   #15
CardDiceian
 
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Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Berkshire - UK
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

I think it's important that bodies are a hazard of some kind. However that ends up being handled in the new rules.
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Old 07-12-2018, 07:15 PM   #16
larsdangly
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

I'd leave the rule in place. It is not that disruptive, in my experience. And it conforms to a more general rule I suspect you'll keep (roll 3d vs. DX when entering a hex with rough terrain). One modification that would make sense, for both bodies and other rough terrain is: If you chose to just step one hex per turn you can enter without a roll. If you enter as part of a longer move, you have to make the roll.
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Old 07-12-2018, 10:20 PM   #17
Steve Jackson
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

New draft; I am listening to the reality comments but I am also listening to my new players who want to feel some of that tactical mobility I've been talking about. I continued to an Obstacles section (for the big book only; no room in Melee) which would largely replace what is there now.

Fallen Bodies
Fallen bodies are obstacles. To leap over one, spend 3 MA.
To move into the hex with a body, either spend 3 MA to move cautiously, or take a move-one-hex option, or follow a retreat, or, if you insist on moving quickly onto the body, spend only one MA but make a 3/DX roll to stay afoot. If you fail, you fall on top of the body or bodies.

Other Obstacles
The GM may add a variety of obstacles, either in arenas or underground, just to keep things interesting.
Pits (see p. 00). They might be full (or half full) of water, lava, tar . . . or they might be bottomless.
Permanent columns of Fire or Darkness, or permanent areas of Sticky or Slippery Floor, as described in the spells.
Bad footing, such as sand, loose gravel, swamp muck, water-slick stone, ankle-deep brush, ice. Bad footing can reduce MA, penalize DX of those who move and fight on the same turn, or even require a saving roll to stay afoot. Details are up to the GM, and the players should not know exactly what to expect when they first step in it.
Columns or tree trunks. Figures must go around tall ones but might leap over short ones.
Quicksand, or just very deep, wet swamp, will reduce MA drastically and might trap a lone wanderer who does not make an IQ roll (Woodsman will help) to escape.
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Old 07-12-2018, 11:21 PM   #18
JLV
 
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Far northern California
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

That looks pretty good to me, and seems to cover all the bases.

(I presume you'll still have some rules on bad footing in general.)
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Old 07-13-2018, 12:52 AM   #19
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

This part is not crystal clear to me as written:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
Fallen Bodies
Fallen bodies are obstacles. To leap over one, spend 3 MA.
Does that mean 3 MA to move two hexes, or 3 MA + 1 MA for the hex on the other side of the body, or an extra 3 MA on top of the normal 2 MA to move two hexes?


Seems to me that hexes with dead bodies in them ought to give a DX penalty to fight from them. It means you can take advantage of them as obstacles during combat, even now that you've made it easier to step on top of them.

I suggest -2 for one body plus -1 for each additional, which is what we mostly used and liked (except when we were having fun with making whole tables for numbers of bodies and all their effects including height advantage...).
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Old 07-13-2018, 03:11 AM   #20
schoon
 
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Oakland, CA, USA
Default Re: Entering A Hex With A Body

I prefer the new concept roles to the old ones - I never much cared for that roll, and the new rules still provide tactical interest.
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