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Old 06-15-2018, 01:47 AM   #1
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

Hi all,
SJG does not have the rights to the Codex, so posting its content here seems wrong. But there surely is not harm in talking about what sorts of questions were raised in the FAQ. So I'm going to summarize them in this post. (I've skipped a handful of questions that are obvious, and reworded many slightly.)
Sometimes I've split a complex question into two questions.
Some of the questions were weirdly specific. I suspect the TFT Editor at the time Guy W. McLinore (who wrote Grail Quest), was using the FAQ as a place to sneak in corrections and minor changes.
If I can't resist making a comment from my own perspective, I prefix them with the characters '//'. some times the answer seems weird to me, so I ask follow up questions.

NEW CONTENT:

Q: Master Vet talent?

Q: Fast Draw talent?

Q: Talent for catching or deflecting thrown weapons?

Q: Weakness spell?

Q: More types of fine armor?


GENERAL QUESTIONS
Q: Can languages be forgotten like talents and spells?

Q: Is a wizard using a weapon that he does not have the talent for at -4 DX or -8 DX? (Using weapon -4 DX from Wizard and -4 DX for no talent from ItL.)

Q: Can wizards use a knife without buying the Knife talent? In HTH? In regular combat?

Q: Do ItL's rules on Wizard's armor over rule those in Basic Wizard?

Q: I'm a wizard who is so smart that I can cast spells with out gestures. Does the armour's DX penalty affect me?

Q: If you fall down due to a dragon's tail attack, can you change your option to stand up?
-- Falling down due to damage?
-- Falling down due to mischance?

// In my (Rick's) campaign, I treat falling down due to damage, much more seriously than other forms of falling.

Q: Exact rules on falling down are ambiguous, when can you stand up? Does next turn mean...
-- Your next action phase?
-- The next turn after the Initiative roll?

Example: Fred was hit by a net and falls down. He had not taken his action this turn. He changes his option to 'stand up' vs net. Can he stand up in the same turn?

Q: If you fall when you have not taken your action, what happens?
-- Figure gets a chance to take his upcoming action.
-- Figure can adjust to the new conditions.
-- Figure loses his action.

Q: Places where this is especially unclear:
-- Net and trident.
-- Aimed shots at legs.
-- Dagger Marksmanship. (Can figure 'pick up a weapon'.)

Q: If you fall in movement can you crawl if you have movement left?


Q: Forced retreats have contradictory rules:
-- AM page 3 states physical attacks only.
-- AM page 18 states physical attacks or missile spells. Which is right?

Q: What attack forms do not get the +2 DX, or +4 DX for facing?
-- Jabs?
-- Pikes?
-- Whips?
-- Missile fire?
-- Invisible target?
-- ??

Q: How are figures with very high ST affected by: Nets, Bolas, Dagger Marksmanship targets?

Q: How are multi-hexed figures affected by nets?

Q: Should thrown rocks use fist damage? It seems weird that a 60 ST Ogre only does 1d-4 throwing a huge rock.


MOVEMENT:

Q: Is a person crawling considered prone? Or kneeling? Can they switch postures?

Q: When it says that you can change facing at the end of movement, is this the end of the figure's moment, or at the end of all movement?

Q: Does Speed Movement Spell affect your MA before, or after you adjust for armor? (So if I have an MA of 10 with leather -2 MA, and get a speed movement cast on me, am I moving 18 or 16?)

Q: Does Speed Movement allow shifting two hexes?

Q: Speed Movement: If you CAN shift two hexes, what happens when you shift one hex into a side, and you are now not engaged. Can you move freely? Is half your movement used up?

Q: If you disengage when you have a speed movement on you, can you disengage two hexes?

Q: What is a figures movement when in a Sticky Floor with a Speed Movement spell?

Q: AM page 4 says jumping over a body costs 3 MA.
AM page 5 says jumping over a body costs 3 MA and requires a 3vsDX saving throw.
-- Does the jump get you over the body (that is, do you move 2 hexes)?
-- Does the jump cost you and extra 3 MA in addition to the distance travelled.
-- Is this 3 MA the entry cost to the new hex?
-- When does this 3vsDX save apply? Is it supposed to be there?


HAND TO HAND COMBAT:

Q: According to the rules attempting HTH happens in movement. Does a pole weapon guy who attacks first get a shot at the guy, 'Jemp', jumping him?
-- If the pole guy "Poul" is set vs. charge and gets an attack, does he get the +2 DX modifier or does Jemp start adjacent during Poul's movement?
-- If Poul rolls a '5' does he get the charge, or does Jemp start adjacent?
-- IF Poul rolls a '6' does he get a charge bonus against Jemp? +2 DX if set vs charge?

Q: If a flier dives on a figure into HTH, but the target rolls a 5, or 6, what happens? Can the flier return into the hex it came from?
-- Use the bomb scatter directions?
-- What happens if bomb scatter lands in an occupied hex?
-- Does he land standing or prone?

Q: To enter HTH you have to come from a "rear". Does this include sides?

Q: To enter HTH the guy you want to jump "target" has his back to a wall. What counts as a wall?
-- A deep pit?
-- Occupied with figures? Friendly? Enemy?
-- // Occupied with heavy brush?
-- // Big fire?

Q: If HTH target has walls in the three hexes opposite from me, (so he can't retreat), can I jump him like his back is to a wall, even if his rear is not facing one of those 3 walls?

Q: Several people are in HTH after they have killed all enemies. What are the rules for them standing up?
-- Roll to get out to move to adjacent hexes?
-- Multiple people stand up in same hex?
-- // Crawl two hexes and stand, like disengaging from under a multihexed figure?

Q: You get +4 DX for being in HTH because you are "in the enemies' rear hex". Does this bonus help when you are trying to disengage from enemy?

Q: You are a wizard attacking into an HTH brawl with several people with a missile spell.
-- If you are adjacent do you count this as a melee attack into HTH?
-- // If you are far away do you count this as a missile weapon attack or a melee attack into HTH?

Q: Can a wizard in HTH cast a spell on someone outside of HTH?

Q: If I'm in HTH can I throw my dagger outside HTH at a big penalty?

// Q. from Rick. I'm a high DX figure surrounded by 6 figures, can I jump one
// in HTH in movement, then disengage from HTH during my action phase to
// get outside my ring of attackers? (My players hate it when I do this to them.
// They feel it is gamey and unrealistic.)
// Note, you might wish to consider making going into HTH an option rather than happening in movement.


TALENTS:

Q: In the Two Weapons talent, the rules refer to rapiers. If I have a half Ogre with a 24 ST, could I wield a 2 handed sword, (which I can now use one handed) as a rapier? What about other swords I can wield one handed?

Q: If you have BOTH the quarter staff and pole weapons talent, can you use a quarter staff like a pole weapon? (For less damage since it's blunt?)
-- Do a two hex jab?
-- Do a charge attack?
// If I have both, can I use my spear like a quarter staff to disarm someone?


New Weapons:

Q: Request for rules on (silent attack) Blackjack or kosh.

Q: Request for rules on Garrot.

Q: Request for rules on strangling.

Last edited by Rick_Smith; 06-15-2018 at 06:17 AM.
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Old 06-15-2018, 01:48 AM   #2
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

WEAPONS:

Q: Can you throw your sword like in the movies (maybe at a big negative)?

Q: Can you catch a thrown object. (Hostile gas bomb, hostile grenade, etc.)?

Q: Can you make a fine dagger? If so how about a fine Main Gauche?
// This question was in the enchanting area, maybe they meant enchant a dagger?
// Question does not make much sense to me.



SPELLS AND DISBELIEVING:

Q: Can you enchant a living being as a magic item?
// -- How about an elephant's tusk? Dead hair?

Q: What is the formula for the spells and potions in the back of AW?

Q: If someone disbelieves a multi-hex obstacle (an Illusion 7 hex fire say), does one hex vanish or the whole thing?
// -- If the whole thing, then what happens if there was a 7 hex fires, two 3 hex fires, and several one hex fires, all Illusions.
// Do we have to remember which was created when?

Q: If I cast an Open Tunnel on enemy but he makes the saving throw to jump away, I pay full fatigue cost, right?

Q: Will a Knock Spell open a really tough 9 die lock?
-- What happens when a Knock spell is cast while someone's picking the lock?
-- What happens when several wizards are casting Knocks at the same time?

Q: You have to stay within 15 hexes of a ward, but that seems very low and most spells have distances in Megahexes. Is this supposed to be 15 MH?

Q: Does Blast spell get thru armor and shields like Shock Shield does?

Q: Same question as above: how about the blast from hitting someone with a Staff or Staff of power?

Q: Drain ST: Can you drain energy and put it directly into a ST Battery? (Do you drain 5 fatigue energy and put it directly into the item, or must you drain 25 energy?)

Q: Can you Drain ST while you are in HTH?

Q: How can you avoid killing someone with Drain ST? How do you know when they will be killed by the spell so you can stop in time?

Q: Can the Staff Spell be cast on:
-- Quarter staff?
-- Bow?
-- Weapons all of wood?
-- Weapons like a crossbow, which is partly wood and partly metal?

Q: If a Staff spell is cast on a Quarter staff, what is the damage?
// Staff of Power?

Q: Can you cast a Hammer Touch into a...
-- Cestus?
-- A dagger (HTH only)?
-- Clubs?
-- Wooden weapons?
-- Wooden shields?
-- Wooden weapons only?
-- Weapons that are a mix of metal and wood?

Q: A rope spell can be cast on a bola (see AW 32). Can it be cast onto a net?

Q: A Charm: does it work before a critical is rolled, or after. (So if you roll a 16 (auto failure), does the charm fix it before the failure? Seems too powerful if before? Curses work the same way?

Q: Do charms work on one die rolls (going into HTH, reaction rolls, splash direction, etc.)
-- Do charms work on rolls the GM makes for me? (e.g. a roll to notice something.)
-- If so, think of an NPC reaction roll (whom I want to impress) made by the GM. Is this roll being "made for me"?

Q: If I have a +2 charm and roll a...
-- 4 which turns into a 2, do I do x4 damage?
-- 3 which turns into a 1, do I do x5 damage?

Q: Can a wish raise a Giant's IQ above 10. His DX above 10?

Q: What should a wish cost?

Last edited by Rick_Smith; 06-15-2018 at 02:01 AM.
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Old 06-15-2018, 02:39 AM   #3
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default Some thoughts about the Fantasy Master's Codex.

Hi all,
The codex flopped, I think, mainly because of its price point. In my FLGS, it cost $17.00 in 1981. I flipped thru it, saw that it was 95% old stuff repackaged, and treated it with contempt.

If I was going to spend that much money, I wanted new crunchy bits by darn.

Several year later, Metagaming was gone, TFT was vanishing, and I saw a couple Fantasy Master Codexes in the bargain bin for $1 each. I picked them up. Who else would buy them?

After getting them super cheap, I found them not very good. If you are producing something with ~100 pages, why not give a full write up of the talents and spells? That would be useful, a player could be looking at talents in ItL, while another was looking up a talent in the Codex. How many different ways do you need to index the spell list? WHY would you want to index Death Test???

There was a listing of monsters, but it just game the stat blocks, not the descriptions (which would have made them much more useful.)

In a post somewhere in this forum, I thought the Codex had a listing of all the magical ingredients. (Quick, what does a Gargoyle Gall Bladder cost?). That would have been useful, but no, not in it. I must have written up my own list, because I had photocopies of a dot matrix listing of that stuff back then.

However, some stuff was actually useful. (It included some new talents and a new spell for example.) The experience table in the rules contradicted the GM's Shield. The codex had a fixed one. The FAQ answered a lot of questions. The list of auto success and auto failures table was very useful. (I didn't get my GM shield until after these Codexes.) I certainly didn't mind having it considering it cost a buck.

I tried to use them, found them too bulky, copied the information I needed into my books or notes and then forgot about them. (My ItL, AM and AW had lots of penciled notes from the various errata for TFT.)

Even in my tender youth, I was bemused at some poor layout. The FAQ was organized into sections. That's fine. But there is a general questions section near the front, and then after HTH, Falling down, talents, there is another general questions area again.

Generally the Codex was a F product. (Or an F-- product if you count the ridiculous price point.)

But if the codex was 1/10 the price, 1/4 the page count and gave rule updates, some new monsters, spells, talents, etc. it could have been actually useful. People would buy them for the new monsters, etc., and get the changes to the living rules of TFT as part of the package. If something like that came out every year or two, I certainly would have bought it.

But I wonder at whomever thought that the package that actually came out, would be a popular item.

Warm regards, Rick.

Last edited by Rick_Smith; 06-19-2018 at 11:55 AM.
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Old 06-15-2018, 03:25 AM   #4
tbeard1999
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Tyler, Texas
Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

It was reviewed in a capsule review in TSG 41. It had a list price of $10, which is what I recall paying. That’s $29 in today’s money. Anyhow, the reviewer made many of the same points and ended with:

“While the index to TFT is quite useful...what Metagaming seems to have with THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1981 is too little for too much. Unless you have to have the index, I'd recommend you grit your teeth and wait for THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1982, which hopefully will be typeset and cost less.”

Last edited by tbeard1999; 06-16-2018 at 08:05 PM.
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Old 06-15-2018, 03:39 AM   #5
Jim Kane
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Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbeard1999 View Post
It was reviewed in a capsule review in TSG 41. It had a list price of $10, which is what I recall paying. That’s $29 in today’s money. Anyhow, the reviewer made many of the same points and ended with:

“While the index to TFT is quite useful (and should have been released separately at a lower price), what Metagaming seems to have with THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1981 is too little for too much. Unless you have to have the index, I'd recommend you grit your teeth and wait for THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1982, which hopefully will be typeset and cost less.”
Wow,... $29 ($10USD1981) for a poorly-printed *magazine* on pulp-paper; no wonder so few bought it.

JK
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Old 06-15-2018, 11:49 AM   #6
schoon
 
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Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

Yeah...

The Codex was awful. The layout was bad, the organization was bad...

But it did have some interesting content for those willing to thresh through the chaff.
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Old 06-15-2018, 12:23 PM   #7
Terquem
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Idaho Falls
Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

I don't want to be a downer here, but you should always be cautious of posting material directly from a document under the protection of copyright, regardless of who might be the holder

There are certain permissions granted by law, such as academic reviews, criticism, and others, but still, be cautious.
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Old 06-15-2018, 12:46 PM   #8
JLV
 
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Location: Far northern California
Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbeard1999 View Post
It was reviewed in a capsule review in TSG 41. It had a list price of $10, which is what I recall paying. That’s $29 in today’s money. Anyhow, the reviewer made many of the same points and ended with:

“While the index to TFT is quite useful (and should have been released separately at a lower price), what Metagarning seems to have with THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1981 is too little for too much. Unless you have to have the index, I'd recommend you grit your teeth and wait for THE FANTASY MASTERS' CODEX 1982, which hopefully will be typeset and cost less.”
Yeah, as I recall, I paid $10 for it originally myself (in my FLGS). I bought it primarily for the Index, but there were a couple of other things that were useful. Rick, your FLGS wasn't so F, it seems...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terquem View Post
I don't want to be a downer here, but you should always be cautious of posting material directly from a document under the protection of copyright, regardless of who might be the holder

There are certain permissions granted by law, such as academic reviews, criticism, and others, but still, be cautious.
To say nothing of the SJG Forum rules about that sort of thing...
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Old 06-15-2018, 03:40 PM   #9
Jim Kane
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Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

JLV, what in the world is an FLGS?

JK
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Old 06-15-2018, 04:27 PM   #10
JLV
 
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Default Re: Questions raised in the Codex FAQ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Kane View Post
JLV, what in the world is an FLGS?

JK
Oh, sorry! That's a "Steve-Jackson-Games-speak" term for "Friendly Local Game Store." (As I'm sure you're aware, SJGs always tries to encourage people to use their local brick and mortar store instead of ordering direct, to try and help keep the stores in business.)

Thus my comment to Rick that his FLGS seemed to be lacking a tad in "F" if they were charging him $17+ for a $10 book! ;-)
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