|
05-01-2016, 06:58 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Dec 2006
|
GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
I have been giving this some thought, trying to distill down the 'essence' of pen and paper role playing. I know this has been attempted in books like Action, role 1 and 2 below are basically what the threat value from pyramid are built to quantify, but I'd like to stay away from that level of quantification.
Thus, I present the RPG character 'role' list (I have listed sub roles, but only the top level role is really important, the sub roles are just different ways to express that):
These roles have a tendency to pull your points in different directions. Notably there are MANY ways to achieve compotency in a given role. A psi with reliable easy to use mind control achieves the murder role, and the social and problem solving roles (sometimes everything IS a nail when you have a hammer). Notably being a standard or RPM mage makes you competent in all 5 categories, depending on how you spend your spells. Now if you HAVE 5 players this is pretty easy; someone fills each role as a primary, another roll as a secondary, and can ignore the rest, perhaps one 'can do everything but with fatigue/location limitations' like a mage. However as the number of players decreases the requirement for each PC to reliably fill multiple roles increases. My standard game is a grand total of 2 PCs and 1 GM (rotating GM with the PCs choosing a 'guest NPC' from the GM's list who they will generally direct in action). Thus it seems almost required that PCs be capable at ~4/5 above. So thoughts: What other sub roles do I need? Have I missed any of the 'core' roles? Why am I posting this: I have been speaking a lot with co GM/player Kal about role playing in general and the rock-paper-scissors approach to PC opposition/challenges, and I am hoping to build, for myself and him, a better understanding of the ultimate 'distilled' abilities that makes up a PC. Last edited by starslayer; 05-01-2016 at 07:55 PM. Reason: suggestions from thread. |
05-01-2016, 07:36 PM | #2 |
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Kenai, Alaska
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Well what about Murders who engage in melee combat, but aren't especially mobile or capable of area of effect? Like a spear welding fighter? His shtick would be turning goons into kabobs, though with only normal human level strength and skill he'd be doing this one at a time.
|
05-01-2016, 07:52 PM | #3 | |
Join Date: Dec 2006
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Quote:
|
|
05-01-2016, 08:29 PM | #4 |
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Hmmm. Considering that Area Denial and High Mobility can also be done from ranged, as well as Indirect Engagement (Spirit Bane weapons against spirits that can't directly engage, Insubstantial with Can Attack Substantial, etc) being able to be Melee... You might want to make the Categories of Murder those three with Ranged and Melee simply flavors of it.
For example: 1. Murder- the ability to kill stuff, whether at range or close. Though admittedly, Indirect is more likely to be a Ranged thing... so... Otherwise, I think you've covered the bases. |
05-01-2016, 08:58 PM | #5 |
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Melbourne, Australia (also known as zone Brisbane)
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Where does resource control fit in? There are characters who can draw on resources outside the PC group through a whole bunch of different mechanisms: scrounging, leadership, reputation, patron, ally, charisma, military rank, social status, wealth etc.
And what about the rogue archetype? And the protector? Or comic relief? |
05-01-2016, 11:59 PM | #6 | |
Join Date: Dec 2006
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Quote:
I don't want to seem hostile, but did you read the list- Resource control specifically referencing almost every one of the items you listed are item 5 under Social interaction? As for the archetypes, again I'm not sure I follow- these are intended to be the roles that PCs/players fill, not the sole definer of what they do- I even mentioned that most PCs will be in multiple roles, so; Rogue- Murder (Sneak attacks), survival (stealth), support (Mundane skills like traps) Protector- Survival(taking hits), Support(pulling agro) Comic Relief- Social, Survival, Support (debuffs through things like Rapier wit) |
|
05-01-2016, 09:06 PM | #7 |
Join Date: Dec 2013
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
A lot of these are redundant or just ways of murdering things. Murder is just a way of solving a problem. Social interaction also falls under problem solving, and what doesn't obviously fall immediately under the umbrella of problem-solving in survival are generally aids to murder. Support is another category that is mostly aids to murder.
|
05-02-2016, 12:33 AM | #8 | |
Join Date: Dec 2006
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Quote:
Murder is a way of getting things dead- which is often a desired end result in both life and role playing, and is sometimes a means to an end. Social interaction is just that- dealing with others, it differs from problem solving in that problem solving is personal your rolling on YOUR search/chemistry/traps skill, rather than trying to convince someone to do something. Support is literally that, it will generally boost (or penalize) any one of the other 4 categories. Healing boosts survival, cursing boosts anything that deals with others. Real life example: I had an infestation of rats (farm land, fact of life). I used problem solving to do some research on the internet and learn about my rodent invaders. I used some more problem solving to go around the outside of the house and reinforce the roof/soffit connections where ice heaving had made the gaps wide enough for the creatures to get in. Then I used more problem solving to actually patch those holes. I still had rats in the house, but more could not get in. Now I switched to murder (indirect- poison), and when that failed Murder (indirect- traps), a few times I had to switch to murder (Ranged- indirect engagement) and once I even had to do Murder (Direct engagement- close up; stomping) All that murder meant that I had to do more problem solving (cleanup and sterilization), and when I realized the attempts to poison the rats had failed problem solving to get rid of the poison. Survival fortunately never played into it (Unless perhaps you count that direct engagement- close up; stomping as having required some type of resistance roll to not have gotten sick from the result) I also did some social interaction when I called experts to make sure I was on the right path, and the wife provided some much needed support when I had to do unpleasant things like mop up blood and sterilize the area. Had my rather mundane life been converted into a full campaign I would have used 3 or 4 of my 5 items encompassing research, prof skill (household repair), traps, Guns (Air rifle), Knife, brawling, prof skill (cleaning), diplomacy/public speaking, and leveraging my average wealth to buy all of the things I needed. My wife would have been using her own problem solving skills to analyze my ideas and tell me which ones were really crazy, and her social skills to explain that to me as well as give me positive encouragement and support during the more unpleasant parts of the endeavor. That'd be a thoroughly boring campaign- but I think it nicely shows how I think all of this comes together. |
|
05-01-2016, 09:06 PM | #9 |
Join Date: Jul 2006
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
The traditional GURPS roles are:
|
05-01-2016, 10:59 PM | #10 | |
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Eindhoven, the Netherlands
|
Re: GURPS PC 'roles'- a thought on pen and paper role playing in general
Quote:
You're not discussing the roles of RPGs, but the roles of GURPS (and mostly Action). GURPS, by default, focuses on what I like to call "Agent" play. The abilities with the highest costs and the most mechanical focus tend to be abilities that agents would use, face-to-face, to get a particular job done. For example, GURPS has four different Influence skills, allowing four different core Influence strategies... but it only has one Politics skill, only one Strategy skill. Other games have different emphasis, different roles (though it's not always obvious, because many games copy one another: If you played nothing but D&D and its many knock-offs, you'd be forgiven for thinking that "Healer" was just a standard role in all games) Imagine, for a moment, you were playing an entirely political game, a game about roman senators and generals trying to outmaneuver one another in an effort to gain empire. Each character has a different focus. Some specialize in demagougery, some focus on hob-nobbing with the aristocracy, some focus more on the military. You have different roles within that political/strategic structure, but none of the "I'm a combat role!" Being able to punch another senator in the face is not particularly useful. GURPS does understand this. That's one of the big points behind the GURPS Template design books: You need to choose the roles/niches appropriate for your campaign. Often, the agent-style of play is what people are looking for and what they want, but not always. The typical GURPS Cabal campaign, in my experience, does not turn on how well you can punch someone in the face, but how well you can subvert organizations and uncover ancient secrets. It's the sort of game where players complain that Archaeology is OP. On the other hand, the combat-oriented roles of GURPS DF is different from the combat-oriented roles of GURPS Monster Hunters or Action. Action, for example, has no "I'm good at dealing with supernatural problems" niche, while DF has several, and Monster Hunters also doesn't... because every character should be good at dealing with the supernatural. Thus, campaign design is game design, and game design is organic. Each game is unique and different. You can move and slot predefined roles into a campaign if you want, but it'll feel like other predefined campaigns. Better to understand how roles work, holistically, and design your niches as appropriate for the intent of your campaign.
__________________
My Blog: Mailanka's Musing. Currently Playing: Psi-Wars, a step-by-step exploration of building your own Space Opera setting, inspired by Star Wars. |
|
Tags |
general advice, niche, role playing |
|
|