Divine Favor

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by DouglasCole

What I'm really looking for, as I said in my post, is jiggering with the POSITIVE points. Specifically:

* I want to be as good a fighter as possible, while
* Maintaining an actual edge/niche as a kicker of Undead coccyx, and
* Having utility as a backup healer in case Brother Michel, our primary, goes down

Aside from my gadget suggestion... :) Protection from Evil (DF 7, 7 cp) gets you True Faith with Turning AND Reliable +10. Undead go aaaaaaaaaa all the way home. Smite requires DF 8, but does 2d burning damage bypassing DR etc to Evil Things. 9 points.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Bruno

On the petition roll, in a DF-type situation:
You can pretty reliably get +2 if you shout and have five minutes to spare, +3 if there's time for 2 hours. 2 hour setups are likely to be "Well crud, the entrance to the dungeon caved in" or "This puzzle lock door is two feet thick of steel and we're running out of ideas" or "The orks cut the bridge! Now how do we cross the Impassable Chasm of Doom!?" type situations - ones where there's a big problem, but it's not immediately stabbing anyone.
DF2 has notes about reconsecrating dungeon altars - that would kick them over to a temporary Holy Area, for another +1. It's also an Amusing nod to nethack.

In a dungeon we're unlikely to find a high holy area but stranger things have happened. Ditto finding 25+ devout servitors of Pharisma.

So just wandering around, you can probably count on +2 reliably, and possibly up to +4. In Towns you might be able to get that up to +6 (or even +7 or +8 if it's a major temple and 1000 worshipers turn out...). My advice is bet on +2 Out Of Town, and +4-5 In Town.

That's all true. However, that still leaves him with an activation roll of 8-9 in a dungeon, which is what I consider "not reliable". And yes, as you note, it becomes much more reliable in town. If he was sticking with Favor 8, that would be enough to be useable in a dungeon - almost on a combat timescale, even (default use takes 1d seconds).

An idea is to talk to Nate about getting a Gadget that' gives you a level or two of Divine Favor - a holy relic that gives you better Pharisma Reception :) A particularly variant idea is to wadd up ALL your Divine Favor into a Holy Symbol, Can be Stolen, Can be Broken, Can be Replaced, Doesn't Work Immediately for the thief - nearly stereotypical AD&D cleric powers there - your stuff doesn't work without a Focus item, but you can get a new one from a temple.

This can make it a LOT cheaper, but will also mean that you'll periodically be deprived of your powers until we reach a new temple of Pharisma, which is kind of sad.

DR 3-5, -15%
Requires inconvenient time/effort to replace (temple only), -15%
SM -6 for serious bling holy symbol, -10% or SM 7 for a merely impressive 5" one, -5%
Can be stolen by stealth or trickery (not immediately useful), -10%

Potential total of -50% (-45% if it's 5" instead of 8")

Oh, that is an interesting idea! Not sure how well it would play with the Learned Prayers, though. You'd still need to spend X points in Divine Favor to qualify for the Alternate Abilities discount. However, a Gadget would let his X points go farther, and unless he adds Gadget to his Prayers too, he should still be able to use them if the holy relic is misplaced or damaged.

[DouglasCole]

Note Cadmus as written has DivFav 8!

[roguebfl]

What's stopping you from adding Pact -25% to your Divine favor so that you can only use you prayiers while you remain true to the following disadvtages

Code of Honor (Pharasmic Code) [-10]; Honesty (15 or less) [-5]; Vow (Own no more than horse can carry) [-10].

and bake the pack lose your powers until you atone?

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by DouglasCole

Note Cadmus as written has DivFav 8!

Right. But you were talking about dropping that to 6, so I was commenting on that assumption. If you're following Bruno's suggestion of making it a Gadget, I guess you can stick with a higher Favor rating and my comments aren't quite so pertinent. =P

Originally Posted by roguebfl

What's stopping you from adding Pact -25% to your Divine favor so that you can only use you prayiers while you remain true to the following disadvtages

Code of Honor (Pharasmic Code) [-10]; Honesty (15 or less) [-5]; Vow (Own no more than horse can carry) [-10].

and bake the pack lose your powers until you atone?

I'd be hesitant to allow Pact limitations on Divine Favor; it already includes some pretty harsh penalties if you violate your god's mandates. Making the Favor shut down entirely strikes me as a Nuisance Effect in this situation. Pact might work on Learned Prayers however.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

Oh, that is an interesting idea! Not sure how well it would play with the Learned Prayers, though. You'd still need to spend X points in Divine Favor to qualify for the Alternate Abilities discount. However, a Gadget would let his X points go farther, and unless he adds Gadget to his Prayers too, he should still be able to use them if the holy relic is misplaced or damaged.

I was thinking just to keep things the same for prereqs that you could stuff all the Learned prayers in the holy symbol. I like your idea too though - it's a little more complex (as you say) BUT it also means you aren't hosed if you loose the symbol - just very restricted.

[roguebfl]

Originally Posted by Bruno

I was thinking just to keep things the same for prereqs that you could stuff all the Learned prayers in the holy symbol. I like your idea too though - it's a little more complex (as you say) BUT it also means you aren't hosed if you loose the symbol - just very restricted.

nah you have the gadget on the divine favor, and earn prays only get 'trigger: holding holy symbol'

as you know them and they not coming from the gadget but you need the gadget to trigger them.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by DouglasCole

That would bring me over the campaign disad limit, and I've already benefited once in-game for being Speed 6.25 vs. Speed 6.

I have no issues in any case with non-integer values of speed, since it can (as above) give a vital edge in some cases.

Oh yes, sorry, I overlooked that part of the post. The need to have a hard disadvantage limit is counter-intuitive to me, so it's something I need to be reminded of. I disagree that a non-integer value is a non-issue, though. The speed advantage you get from being 0.25 faster isn't worth 5 CP.

But if you can't drop another 5 CP of disad somewhere (and I couldn't see anything that looked particularly droppable), then the best way to look at things might be that you're only 15 CP away from purchasing Speed 7.00 with earned experience points.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

I disagree that a non-integer value is a non-issue, though. The speed advantage you get from being 0.25 faster isn't worth 5 CP.

That initive bonus can come in handy

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by Refplace

That initive bonus can come in handy

Sure, it's not nothing. But I don't think it's worth 5 CP. Which also means I think the fair compensation for selling Speed down to the nearest integer value should be somewhat less than 5 CP per 0.25 Speed.