Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-28-2011, 03:17 AM   #11
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyv, Ukraine
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
I'm more than a little foggy about just what virtue 3D mapping has...except when you are travelling at such speeds that multiple celestial bodies are within your field of engagement.
3D mapping becomes interesting once your ship attack ranges are comparable to your typical speed per turn (e.g. if both range from 1 to 5 or 10 hexes or other standard units). It becomes even more interesting if ship sizes are comparable to hex sizes . . . (Yes, this is an SW example, was there ever any doubt?)

3D mapping generally means the grid is no longer hexagonal (there would be no sense in that). The simplest replacement grid is made of cubes, though I wonder if some other shape is viable (I think not). Using intersections of grid lines, instead of centres of grid sections, also seems a bit more convenient IMHO.
If there is no automatic alignment along the Z-axis (the axis parallel to ship vector forward), this will also remove the other effect of '2D Space' - the fact that when two ships approach each other, no matter where they come from, they will always be oriented the same way; you never see a ship flying "upside down".

The question how many people would use it remains. Just how many people are using ericbsmith's spaceships sheet? (Speaking of which, importing any sort of data from an xls is out of the question.)
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 08:37 AM   #12
JCurwen3
 
JCurwen3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
The question how many people would use it remains. Just how many people are using ericbsmith's spaceships sheet? (Speaking of which, importing any sort of data from an xls is out of the question.)
I would definitely be interested in using it. I know it has the potential to add an extra dimension to my spaceship battles (yes, I meant that both figuratively and was also well aware of the pun)...

As far as importing from Excel, the COM / OLE automation force is strong within me, so if that becomes something desirable, I'd be happy to do the coding to add support for that.
__________________
-JC
JCurwen3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 08:58 AM   #13
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyv, Ukraine
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCurwen3 View Post
I would definitely be interested in using it. I know it has the potential to add an extra dimension to my spaceship battles (yes, I meant that both figuratively and was also well aware of the pun)...

As far as importing from Excel, the COM / OLE automation force is strong within me, so if that becomes something desirable, I'd be happy to do the coding to add support for that.
OK, the roaming camera is working already.
I'm currently downloading Blender because apparently I don't have a nice FBX-formatted cone primitive on my computer (I'll need a cone to denote legal movement zones and gunnery arcs later).

Currently, I see a ship template as consisting of the ship placeholder (object which is there to be something concrete with specific coordinates and facing, and to which actual ship models will be childed later), its vector child (this one is likely to remain abstract), and line renderers to denote ship facing direction and the straight path between the ship's current position and the vector's position.

I figured the best way to implement 3D movement is similar to the way Homeworld 2 does it:
When a ship is to be moved, activate an invisible plane collider at the vertical coordinates of the ship/vector/target (both horizontal coordinates centred on the original ship coords), and while mouse button is pressed (i.e. dragging the vector/ship/etc.), project a RayCast onto this plane (only); the new coordinates are the hit point of the RayCast onto the plane. However, with Shift pressed, vertical mouse movement is mapped into an adjustment of the vertical coordinate instead (no RayCast involved).
Of course, for starters I'm just gonna try 2D dragging.

Oh, and I now realized that it's much easier to make the engine hex-agnostic. Figuring which hex's centre is closest to the new coordinates is a bother that might, unless I learn some short way of doing it, chew up some resources (as silly as it sounds).
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 09:09 AM   #14
Blind Mapmaker
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Mannheim, Baden
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Just wanted to say that this sounds great. Many thanks for trying your hands on this. Personally I don't care about hexes, but 2D only would be a bit of a game-breaker for my group. Of course, we aren't actually playing a space campaign yet. Anyway, I'm really looking forward to this.
Blind Mapmaker is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2011, 01:57 PM   #15
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyv, Ukraine
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Okay, the ships move, rotate, and can be spawned (right now with just an ugly button). There is also an algorithm that allows a 'ship' to be constructed as a formation of other ships, but it is disabled due to lack of ship models (it's kinda pointless without them). Currently, I only have an algorithm for constructing a Pyramid formation, but I suppose I will later add such formations as a cube, a screen, and maybe some other.

Here are some things that are a priority to turn it from an ugly sub-alpha into a beta with actual usefulness in a GURPS Spaceships Battle:
  • Ship models in FBX format.
  • A hex grid can be tiled without much adjustment, in PNG.
  • A space skybox, perhaps even several.
  • A method of drawing/scaling a cone in such a way that its 'flat' part is replaced by a slice of a sphere of different angle depending on some variables (to represent accessible area for shooting/flying).

Some features that I think are doable:
  • Saving camera settings etc.
  • (Somewhat harder) Saving ship/vector positions and rotations (and HP, notes etc.).
  • Drawing helper lines to aid in visualization of directions and angles.
  • Rangefinder that helps figure distance and angle from a selected ship to a target (either ship or vector).
  • Ability to enter raw coordinates and eulerAngles instead of using the mouse.
  • Alternate camera modes, including orthogonal (for people who find the roaming 3D camera disorienting).

If you're absolutely fearless, I can show this little work in progress already by sending the files in an archive.
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2011, 05:30 PM   #16
Ronnke
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Australia
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Not much to comment, just posting to show my interest in this project. Any chance of some screenshots of the WIP?

I play much of my gaming online, have you considered a simple client/server interface so remote clients could control some of the elements?
Ronnke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2011, 01:02 PM   #17
oldgringo2001
 
oldgringo2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Silicon Valley
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

If you want to try out a simple 3D vector graph-paper-based game, you can download Vector 3 at Greg Costikyan's site for free. It's an adaption of the 3D system of Battlefleet Mars, which Greg helped develop.

Oh. He also designed something called Toon.

Last edited by oldgringo2001; 11-02-2011 at 08:47 PM. Reason: correction
oldgringo2001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2011, 02:19 PM   #18
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyv, Ukraine
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnke View Post
Not much to comment, just posting to show my interest in this project. Any chance of some screenshots of the WIP?
I wanted to make at least a rudimentary GUI before doing that.
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2011, 04:02 PM   #19
JCurwen3
 
JCurwen3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
If you're absolutely fearless, I can show this little work in progress already by sending the files in an archive.
I'm generally Unfazeable, so I'd check it out / play with it as it is now. Only if that would help out (I have done a lot of QA as well as software development), not if it would put you out or be an unhelpful inconvenience to start getting feedback or thoughts at this stage.
__________________
-JC
JCurwen3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2011, 05:29 PM   #20
ClayDowling
 
ClayDowling's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Default Re: Spaceships: Chance of a space combat aid. But is there a need? 2D or 3D?

Her point is that there isn't a screenshot to be had. No GUI, so no screen to shoot.

If you're interested in the client/server setup, I'd be happy to lend a hand. It's something I do as part of the day job.
__________________
Online Campaign Planning
ClayDowling is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
game aid, gurps spaceship battles, spaceships

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.