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Old 03-15-2017, 09:14 AM   #1
Rabenrecht
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Default Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

I'm fairly new at GURPS so I'm probably quite late to the Party with this question. Still, this is bothering me.

When I compare the Prices for TL 0 - 3 armor from the Basic Set to one listed in LowTech Instant armor I see quite a difference.

Of Course the question is: what Prices are the "correct" ones?
I only own Instant Armor, not the actual LowTech. Just for the case this is adresssed there...
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Old 03-15-2017, 09:18 AM   #2
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

While the official word tries to soft-pedal it, Basic Set low-tech armor is essentially nonsense. If you want it at all real, use Low Tech. Regardless of what you use, don't try to use Basic and Low Tech armor together, they're incompatible.

That said, low-tech armor costs are probably not especially correct either, from a perspective of history or economic realism. From discussions, the author seems to have used game balance as a factor in pricing. At least the weight and DR values probably make sense, though.
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Old 03-15-2017, 09:39 AM   #3
trooper6
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

You can use either one. Both are correct for different uses. The Dungeon Fantasy line, if I recall correctly, uses the Basic Set armor system. But Low Tech goes for a different vibe than Dungeon Fantasy. So it is your choice.
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Old 03-15-2017, 11:05 AM   #4
Polydamas
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Generally, if you want realistic detail about preindustrial techology, use Low Tech. If you want realistic prices, look them up in your local library. Its impossible to give one set of prices which is correct everywhere in the world for several thousand years.
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Old 03-15-2017, 11:09 AM   #5
Ulzgoroth
 
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Quote:
Originally Posted by Polydamas View Post
Generally, if you want realistic detail about preindustrial techology, use Low Tech. If you want realistic prices, look them up in your local library. Its impossible to give one set of prices which is correct everywhere in the world for several thousand years.
...Good luck with looking up the prices of historical armor in your local library...
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Old 03-15-2017, 11:11 AM   #6
Polydamas
 
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

I did it in my undergrad days ... and today there are all kinds of things online which your reference librarian can help you find.

One place to start is Thorkild Rogers' History of Agriculture and Prices in England. That was very widely printed about a hundred years ago, so copies are available all over.
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Old 03-16-2017, 01:54 AM   #7
Rabenrecht
 
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Ok, I will use LowTech prices then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
That said, low-tech armor costs are probably not especially correct either, from a perspective of history or economic realism. From discussions, the author seems to have used game balance as a factor in pricing.
That's a given. What else should those prices respresent anyway? Certainly not anything historical (they are given in Dollar for starters...).


Also, figuring out historical prices for gear is not a simple matter of finding a historical source with some numbers, especially of those numbers are given in form of currency. Medieval currency didn't have a set value over time.
Numers given in cows (or something) would be more useful, as the relative value of a cow would presumbly not change much over the course of the centuries.
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Old 03-16-2017, 03:26 AM   #8
Ulzgoroth
 
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabenrecht View Post
That's a given. What else should those prices respresent anyway? Certainly not anything historical (they are given in Dollar for starters...).
Er, why not? GURPS dollars are not US$ and are used in all time periods. Honestly, I'm very bothered by game balance being considered at all in a tech book about real stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabenrecht View Post
Also, figuring out historical prices for gear is not a simple matter of finding a historical source with some numbers, especially of those numbers are given in form of currency. Medieval currency didn't have a set value over time.
Numers given in cows (or something) would be more useful, as the relative value of a cow would presumbly not change much over the course of the centuries.
Yes, to determine a GURPS$ price from records would require both a price of record from the item and prices of record for some staples in the same currency, time, and place.

(And, of course, realistically such prices could vary a great deal.)
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Old 03-16-2017, 07:00 AM   #9
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Also, I recall one of the Low Tech team saying something along the lines that even in Low Tech the armour prices are based on relative effectiveness rather than any estimate of production costs ... again, probably due to the problems of estimating production costs.
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Old 03-16-2017, 07:12 AM   #10
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Default Re: Armor Prices: Basic vs. Low Tech

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
Also, I recall one of the Low Tech team saying something along the lines that even in Low Tech the armour prices are based on relative effectiveness rather than any estimate of production costs ... again, probably due to the problems of estimating production costs.
That would have been Dan Howard, who did the Armor section.
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