[DF] Making Bad Temper Bad for Murder Hobos

[Stripe]

Bad temper is one of the most common disadvantages in Dungeon Fantasy. However, a disadvantage that isn't a disadvantage isn't a disadvantage and in most dungeons, the the entire point is to get pumped up and kill everything.

The obvious way to make bad temper a disadvantage in a dungeon is to put someone or something in there that isn't supposed to be attacked for whatever reason. My favorite is to make that something more powerful than any PC with bad temper, and make that something obnoxious.

Once, I ran a Third Edition game where a drunken, somewhat-elderly dwarf (not a D&D/Warhammer/DF dwarf) was being pushy and belligerent in a tavern. He wasn't a fighter at all. He was a cobbler and shoe salesman, not a smith of any sort (again, not D&D/DF).

Well, the ill-tempered PC wanted to punch him in the nose with the "justification" that he had bad temper. Fine. He knocks him cold.

Then, a towering, full-plate wearing, great axe-wielding ogre walks in. Someone whispers that the ogre, named Gorefist, is an infamous gladiator turned mercenary and head-hunter. And, the big ogre warrior has three friends who are also big ogre warriors sporting mail, plenty of weapons and lots of battle scars.

Of course, all are crass and hostile.

But, now all of a sudden the PC doesn't want to use his bad temper as justification to attack!

"What?!" says I. "Oh, no. You have bad temper! Punch the ogre like you did the poor old dwarf!"

I've also done the rude mayor's son or sheriff in the bar and escort missions for nobles that were condescending and insulting. I've even done a city with a curse: "If any blood is spilled in violence on this ground, famine and war will be visited on the land." Things like that. There are several ways to make bad temper bad.

But, like I say, in a dungeon, rather than in the surrounding adventure, it's not quite as easy to come up with several different ways to tick a PC off when getting ticked off has serious negative consequences for that PC.

What are some of the ways that you've made bad temper a disadvantage inside a dungeon?

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Stripe

What are some of the ways that you've made bad temper a disadvantage inside a dungeon?

I watch for in-party tensions and have them make SC rolls (although most of the time players are on top of in character outbursts, anyway). Frustration with puzzles is another great reason for a Bad Temper SC roll, particularly if it leads to triggering something that you don't want triggered.

[Refplace]

A delicate device that holds a frustrating puzzle for the PCs to figure out but break it because you get mad and you never get the treasure.
Other PC interaction can trigger a roll.
An arguement over splitting of the loot could turn ugly.
NPC encounters you need to talk through rather then fight.

[Maz]

Enemies taunting you to attack where it would be better to do something else.
Enemies taunting you to run at them (into trap-filled area).

---

In a purely combat-game I run I rule that any time you are attack you have to make a Bad Temper roll. If you fail you must attack back. If you can't attack the one who attacked you, you may chose to attack another enemy. If that's not possible you must chose to either Do nothing (yelling angrily) or Move towards the enemy. The turn your suffering from Bad Temper, you gain +2 levels of fearlessness.

(And it may not be a Defensive Attack or a Feint)


I have made similar rules for other common none-disads.

For instance for Overconfidence I have rule that: You have to make a self-control roll when ever you want to take an Aim Action, Evaluate or All out defense. If you fail, you must take another actions (you don't need to be careful or take aim, your awesome!). The turn you fail a Self-control roll you gain +1 Fearlessness.

or Impulsive: You have to make a self-control roll when ever you want to take an Aim Action, Evaluate, Wait or Do Nothing (unless stunned). If you fail, you must take another actions (can't wait!).

[b-dog]

A good encounter for a PC with Bad Temper might be to have a super-naturally electrified orc taunt the PC and when he strikes it with his sword it sends a 10d jolt of electricity to the PC.

[Whyte]

Originally Posted by b-dog

A good encounter for a PC with Bad Temper might be to have a super-naturally electrified orc taunt the PC and when he strikes it with his sword it sends a 10d jolt of electricity to the PC.

I respectfully but firmly disagree. This would be an example of a 'gotcha' encounter, in my opinion, where the GM tries to hose the players.

Bad Temper comes with a self-control roll. That is precisely so that the PC can try to rein in his temper rather than lash out when such an action might result in more trouble than he is willing to take.

If your campaign doesn't feature anything else than dungeon crawling, well then, I can see why you have a problem. Sir Pudding's & Refplace's suggestions for example would be good. Also if the other PCs argue against the course of action advocated by the PC with a Bad Temper. And of course, the usual taunting enemies, trying to provoke the PC into charging out of cover or something like that, putting the PC into a tactical disadvantage if he fails the SC roll (like advancing too deep and letting another enemy to outflank him). I'd avoid Electro-Orcs, though.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Whyte

I respectfully but firmly disagree. This would be an example of a 'gotcha' encounter, in my opinion, where the GM tries to hose the players.

As b-dog has expressed before, his play style is generally Gygaxian in nature, so hosing the players is kinda the whole point. I agree that I would never do that in my own campaign, and am generally turned off from playing with an adversarial GM, but some folks roll that way. To my mind, the purpose of disadvantages isn't to make PCs' lives shorter, but instead more interesting (ie, complicated). Bad Temper can do just that, causing some inter-party conflict and heightening the tension at times.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by Whyte

I respectfully but firmly disagree. This would be an example of a 'gotcha' encounter, in my opinion, where the GM tries to hose the players.

Bad Temper comes with a self-control roll. That is precisely so that the PC can try to rein in his temper rather than lash out when such an action might result in more trouble than he is willing to take.

That said, bdog's implementation may be um, extreme, but the basic concept is in line with other people's recommendations - put them in a situation where failing their self-control roll (or waiving the self-control roll and saying "My character is cranky and punches him" voluntarily) is not in the characters best interest.

A 1d or 2d "electro-orc" (Stun jelly, lightning elemental, mage with Fire Armor up, whatever) isn't out of line in most games, and might be perfectly obvious that they're surrounded by a field of dangerous energy. A character without Bad Temper (or other mental disads of a similar ilk) can stand back at a distance and not attack at all, or throw rocks, or whatever, regardless of how insulting/offensive/obscene the monster is. But that's why Bad Temper is a disad - if you fail the self control roll when provoked, you do something stupid.

See also The Tar Baby, which is a 130 year old relative of bdogs electric orc - sticky instead of 10d damage though.

Note that Bad Temper doesn't require physical violence: " If you fail, you lose your temper and must insult, attack, or otherwise act against the cause of the stress." - but in a Murder Hobo game "Attack" certainly is a good default. The players usually can't argue that sophontcide isn't in character if you're calling them "Murder Hobos" :D

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Maz

In a purely combat-game I run I rule that any time you are attack you have to make a Bad Temper roll. If you fail you must attack back. If you can't attack the one who attacked you, you may chose to attack another enemy. If that's not possible you must chose to either Do nothing (yelling angrily) or Move towards the enemy. The turn your suffering from Bad Temper, you gain +2 levels of fearlessness.

(And it may not be a Defensive Attack or a Feint)


I have made similar rules for other common none-disads.

For instance for Overconfidence I have rule that: You have to make a self-control roll when ever you want to take an Aim Action, Evaluate or All out defense. If you fail, you must take another actions (you don't need to be careful or take aim, your awesome!). The turn you fail a Self-control roll you gain +1 Fearlessness.

or Impulsive: You have to make a self-control roll when ever you want to take an Aim Action, Evaluate, Wait or Do Nothing (unless stunned). If you fail, you must take another actions (can't wait!).

I kinda like these will have t consider them for future games.
Most of the time my players play up their disads so I dont have to enforce them much.

[Stripe]

I'm not of the opinion that b-dog's example was a bad one. But, I don't think I would be so crude about it.

How about a demon-possessed friend?

How about a person holding a child as a shield?

How about a person who is the only one who knows where the treasure is or the imposter's true identity?

Also note from B121:

"You never have to try a self-control roll – you can always give in willingly, and it is good roleplaying to do so."

"Be aware that if you attempt self-control rolls too often, the GM may penalize you for bad roleplaying by awarding you fewer earned points."

Bold emphasis mine.

To me, that means a good role player isn't rolling when confronted with b-dog's electro-orc or whatever. Now, a good role player may think of a way to "insult, attack, or otherwise act against the cause of the stress" in some way not including your metal sword that b-dog, as the GM, is ruling will cause a shocking backlash, but they're not rolling against SC.

A player shouldn't roll SC every session, in my opinion. Maybe every other. Maybe every third. Or, just maybe, never. Gasp!