Digital eBook reader devices... - Page 8

Jürgen Hubert · 05-27-2009, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham

As for cost: my Bookeen Cybook Gen 3 will have paid for itself towards the end of this year (I've had it for 18 months so far). eBooks and eMagazines are cheaper than their paper counterparts. From then on, I'm saving money.

I suspect that in my case any letter-sized ebook reader will pay for itself very quickly. After all, most RPG publishers release their latest books as PDFs as well...

Graham · 05-27-2009, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert

I suspect that in my case any letter-sized ebook reader will pay for itself very quickly. After all, most RPG publishers release their latest books as PDFs as well...

Hmmm. I was going to jump in again with whole-hearted agreement, but then I thought this through. An A4/Letter-sized one will only pay for itself if I buy pdfs of books that I would otherwise have bought as hard or softcover. It's rare that I buy real books for anything but GURPS these days, so this could take a long, long while. What's more, it'll probably get me spending even more on pdfs than I do now (good news for SJG).

But I still want one. :-)

Edit: just realised that I'd also save on printing costs. Hurrah!

Graham

~~Peter Knutsen~~ · 06-15-2009, 11:36 AM

I just did a test, after some discussion in the Danish literature Usenet group.

I cranked my CRT up to 1600 pixels width x 1200 pixels height, and loaded GURPS Mysteries, and found a page where one column was pure text (page 11, right-most column). I switched to full-screen reading mode (Ctrl+L, IIRC) to make the most of my screen's resolution.

And then I took a good, hard look.

Surprisingly readable

Of course my screen flickers a lot at 60 hz, but a handheld wouldn't do that since it uses e-ink (nor would a LCD/TFT display). The test was about whether the letter size was readable or not and it was. I don't think it matters whether those 1200 pixels in height are on a 19" diagonal screen or on a 9" diagonal one.

I also counted the lines. I got 60 lines of text in all, thus 20 pixels of height per letter, ignoring the upper and lower margins and also the spacing between lines. And noting that the font used has serifs - a sans-serif font would be even more readable.

I think I'm a convert. Except for megapixel-grade handhelds (i.e. able to do 1200 pixels in height) being too expensive. And possibly not available in Denmark. But both of those will change.

And I'll (almost) stop demanding 3 megapixels. 1 might actually be sufficient.

TorgSmith · 06-15-2009, 07:28 PM

I did not buy the Amazon Kindle DX. This is the research I did on it. It is getting closer. Some of the down sides I have read about this reader are as follows. All of your files reside in one directory. You can't create sub directories. I have bought hundreds of PDFs and this is not good. The max memory is 3.2GB. I have over 4GB of PDFs. The margin cropping does not always work correctly. I am not sure why but I bet it is PDFs with graphics in the margins that many RPG books have. The only way to increase the font on the PDFs is to rotate the display into landscape so you will have more page flips to get through the material. The actual page flip takes about a second and you get a flash. Most people said the flash did not bother them. The PDF reader in the Kindle does not support annotations and table of contents. I am not entirely sure what the table of contents is as far as PDFs. I do not know if this is the default bookmarks. I think you can create bookmarks but these comments were not totally clear to me.

One thing you want to consider is that an 8.5 by 11 inch sheet of paper has a 13.9 inch diagonal. To get the whole page feel you would want a 14 inch screen.

Jürgen Hubert · 06-15-2009, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TorgSmith

The PDF reader in the Kindle does not support annotations and table of contents.

This... is disappointing.

Making annotations in ebooks is one of the most useful features of my Kindle 1 - I like to go through gaming-related electronic texts (my campaign setting, ebook versions of the Arcana Wiki and the TV Tropes Wiki, the collected Suppressed Transmissions columns) and make annotations in the margins - it's a great way of remembering gaming ideas.

If the Kindle DX does not offer this feature, then I will not buy it and instead wait for another PDF reader which can do it. Thanks for the warning.

TorgSmith · 06-17-2009, 06:57 PM

Amazon just released the source code for all their Kindles. What this means is that other people could write the applications that run on it. I did not bother trying to find out what licensing went with it. Most of my negative comments about the Kindle DX are probably all software related and would not require a hardware change to improve. Again I do not know this for a fact and I am just guessing.

I am providing the link to the source as a validation that this is indeed true. I would not bother downloading it as it is 137MB in size. I did download the code and gave it a cursorily look over. Most of the code is in C with a couple solutions in C++ and Java. It looked more to be the code for the OS (Linux I believe) of the device. I did not see the PDF reader code in it, but could have over looked it. What this source does offer is the ability for a third party to create a PDF reader for this device. Depending what legal hoops a commercial group would have to jump through to distribute an update is unknown by me. The fact that the Kindle Books competes with Adobe's DRMed reader format reduces the chance that Adobe would be willing to create a reader for the Kindle.

We will have to wait and see what happens with this development. I am hopeful.

Source code
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/custom...deId=200203720

Buzzardo · 06-17-2009, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TorgSmith

I am hopeful.

Source code
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/custom...deId=200203720

Save your hope, at least for now.

Here's the other shoe dropping.

tjoneslo · 06-18-2009, 06:15 AM

TechCrunch is now prototyping a kindle sized browser only computer with touch screen and unknown other specifications. This is an neat looking, real computer which runs only a browser on a 3G or wireless network. You can run any application as long as you can run it in a browser.

This is my new techno-lust object, now that the kindle DX has failed to meet all expectations (especially cost).

AOTA · 06-18-2009, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjoneslo

TechCrunch is now prototyping a kindle sized browser only computer with touch screen and unknown other specifications.

That looks sweet. I wonder what the price point will be.

~~Peter Knutsen~~ · 10-01-2009, 08:26 PM

A week or two ago, I read about a product called Plastic Logic, some sort of ebook reader, to be released early next year.

They didn't say anything about specifications, but it was going to be cheap. I'm on their mailing list, so as there's new information, I'll be informed, and if it's anything interested, I'll post about it in this thread.

There's also a rumour that Apple is working on something, and Asus has a weird book-shaped gadget on the way that sounds like it'll be wildly expensive (i.e. the wrong take on the issue).

Anyone else got any news?

(Note, I'm not a sales rep for Plastic Logic. I'm just an interested consumer. As far as I'm concerned, the one gadget which will mean that the future has finally arrived is a cheap, high-resolution, light-weight handheld e-book reader that can handle large formats such as A4 and Letter pages, both PDF and HTML.)

06-15-2009, 11:36 AM	#73
~~Peter Knutsen~~ Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Europe	Re: Digital eBook reader devices... I just did a test, after some discussion in the Danish literature Usenet group. I cranked my CRT up to 1600 pixels width x 1200 pixels height, and loaded GURPS Mysteries, and found a page where one column was pure text (page 11, right-most column). I switched to full-screen reading mode (Ctrl+L, IIRC) to make the most of my screen's resolution. And then I took a good, hard look. Surprisingly readable Of course my screen flickers a lot at 60 hz, but a handheld wouldn't do that since it uses e-ink (nor would a LCD/TFT display). The test was about whether the letter size was readable or not and it was. I don't think it matters whether those 1200 pixels in height are on a 19" diagonal screen or on a 9" diagonal one. I also counted the lines. I got 60 lines of text in all, thus 20 pixels of height per letter, ignoring the upper and lower margins and also the spacing between lines. And noting that the font used has serifs - a sans-serif font would be even more readable. I think I'm a convert. Except for megapixel-grade handhelds (i.e. able to do 1200 pixels in height) being too expensive. And possibly not available in Denmark. But both of those will change. And I'll (almost) stop demanding 3 megapixels. 1 might actually be sufficient.

06-15-2009, 07:28 PM	#74
TorgSmith Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Mission Tx	Re: Digital eBook reader devices... I did not buy the Amazon Kindle DX. This is the research I did on it. It is getting closer. Some of the down sides I have read about this reader are as follows. All of your files reside in one directory. You can't create sub directories. I have bought hundreds of PDFs and this is not good. The max memory is 3.2GB. I have over 4GB of PDFs. The margin cropping does not always work correctly. I am not sure why but I bet it is PDFs with graphics in the margins that many RPG books have. The only way to increase the font on the PDFs is to rotate the display into landscape so you will have more page flips to get through the material. The actual page flip takes about a second and you get a flash. Most people said the flash did not bother them. The PDF reader in the Kindle does not support annotations and table of contents. I am not entirely sure what the table of contents is as far as PDFs. I do not know if this is the default bookmarks. I think you can create bookmarks but these comments were not totally clear to me. One thing you want to consider is that an 8.5 by 11 inch sheet of paper has a 13.9 inch diagonal. To get the whole page feel you would want a 14 inch screen. __________________ Thank You, Torg Smith

06-17-2009, 06:57 PM	#76
TorgSmith Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Mission Tx	Re: Digital eBook reader devices... Amazon just released the source code for all their Kindles. What this means is that other people could write the applications that run on it. I did not bother trying to find out what licensing went with it. Most of my negative comments about the Kindle DX are probably all software related and would not require a hardware change to improve. Again I do not know this for a fact and I am just guessing. I am providing the link to the source as a validation that this is indeed true. I would not bother downloading it as it is 137MB in size. I did download the code and gave it a cursorily look over. Most of the code is in C with a couple solutions in C++ and Java. It looked more to be the code for the OS (Linux I believe) of the device. I did not see the PDF reader code in it, but could have over looked it. What this source does offer is the ability for a third party to create a PDF reader for this device. Depending what legal hoops a commercial group would have to jump through to distribute an update is unknown by me. The fact that the Kindle Books competes with Adobe's DRMed reader format reduces the chance that Adobe would be willing to create a reader for the Kindle. We will have to wait and see what happens with this development. I am hopeful. Source code http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/custom...deId=200203720 __________________ Thank You, Torg Smith

06-18-2009, 06:15 AM	#78
tjoneslo Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Vermont	Re: Digital eBook reader devices... TechCrunch is now prototyping a kindle sized browser only computer with touch screen and unknown other specifications. This is an neat looking, real computer which runs only a browser on a 3G or wireless network. You can run any application as long as you can run it in a browser. This is my new techno-lust object, now that the kindle DX has failed to meet all expectations (especially cost). __________________ Thomas Jones-Low: tjoneslow@gmail.com Vehicle Builder Guru and gearhead Librarian at Traveller Wiki

10-01-2009, 08:26 PM	#80
~~Peter Knutsen~~ Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Europe	Re: Digital eBook reader devices... A week or two ago, I read about a product called Plastic Logic, some sort of ebook reader, to be released early next year. They didn't say anything about specifications, but it was going to be cheap. I'm on their mailing list, so as there's new information, I'll be informed, and if it's anything interested, I'll post about it in this thread. There's also a rumour that Apple is working on something, and Asus has a weird book-shaped gadget on the way that sounds like it'll be wildly expensive (i.e. the wrong take on the issue). Anyone else got any news? (Note, I'm not a sales rep for Plastic Logic. I'm just an interested consumer. As far as I'm concerned, the one gadget which will mean that the future has finally arrived is a cheap, high-resolution, light-weight handheld e-book reader that can handle large formats such as A4 and Letter pages, both PDF and HTML.)