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Old 08-05-2020, 09:29 AM   #11
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post


Super? Originally Superman was just a strong, fast, tough alien from a race that evolved under a different set of circumstances. .
His abilities surpass anything possible in Bio-tech. That would be an effective ST of 35 and Super Jump 2. Even if Bio-tech isn't your limit his equivalent of ATP would have to be more powerful than nitroglycerin and his body temp should be above the boiling point of water during super exertion.

His metaboliam (whether it aborbs solar energy or not) is beyond realistic science even if Siegel and Schuster didn't know that.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:01 AM   #12
naloth
 
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
His abilities surpass anything possible in Bio-tech. That would be an effective ST of 35 and Super Jump 2. Even if Bio-tech isn't your limit his equivalent of ATP would have to be more powerful than nitroglycerin and his body temp should be above the boiling point of water during super exertion.
A race that's x16 times as strong, pistol proof, and can accelerate to 50 mph instantly does tend to stretch the bounds of realism. Perhaps the 30s was a touch more optimistic about what was possible or perhaps it was just what passed for cinematic sci-fi at the time?

I don't have Biotech, but I'm curious how they came up with ST 35 and Super Jump 2 as practical limits. The ST seems pretty high and the Super Jump seems rather low.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:04 AM   #13
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
...the Super Jump seems rather low.
There's a cat species called the Serval, which is about twice the size of a housecat (20 to 40 lbs.) It can jump 10 feet into the air without a running start and without really exerting itself. Amazing animal.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:10 AM   #14
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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I considered Enhanced Running, but with Super Jump 5 Kryptonians can already bound at Move 19 (40mph, which isn't far off the traveling rate of a 1930s locomotive). At best it's an AA worth a few points.
And yet it's quite clear in that first story that Superman is not travelling alongside the train in great bounds like John Carter on Mars. He's shown as running. And dramatically, I think seeing him bounce along like a kangaroo would make him look comedic rather than heroic; the gait isn't quite suited to the human physique that he shares.

I also think that, however you represent his movement, there is a strong case to be made for give him higher Basic Speed, because it seems as if Superman has superhumanly good reflexes. If you gave him Basic Speed 12, he would get Basic Move 12 for free, which would roughly double his jumping ability—and his running ability, if you go that way. And he would always be able to act faster than any normal human.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:13 AM   #15
whswhs
 
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by naloth View Post
A race that's x16 times as strong, pistol proof, and can accelerate to 50 mph instantly does tend to stretch the bounds of realism. Perhaps the 30s was a touch more optimistic about what was possible or perhaps it was just what passed for cinematic sci-fi at the time?
His abilities are closely similar to those of Hugo Danner in Philip Wylie's pulp novel Gladiator. And Wells showed much more enhanced speed than that in "The New Accelerator," where the protagonists were at some risk of their clothes catching fire from air friction (though I think realistically they would have found themselves naked first).
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:27 AM   #16
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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I considered Enhanced Running, but with Super Jump 5 Kryptonians can already bound at Move 19 (40mph, which isn't far off the traveling rate of a 1930s locomotive).
Well, to be perfectly fair here, it wasn't "Faster than a Locomotive" it was "Faster than a speeding bullet! More powerful than a locomotive! Able to leap tall buildings at a single bound!"

If you take that literally, we get a peak move over 500 and a peak ST in excess of 200.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:29 AM   #17
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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I don't have Biotech, but I'm curious how they came up with ST 35 and Super Jump 2 as practical limits. The ST seems pretty high and the Super Jump seems rather low.
Technically it's a Racial +10 ST and +5 Lift/Strike/HP and then 10 pts individually above Racial average. You could have the Lift/Strike/HP other ways as long as no aspect was more than +10 and the total of the 3 no more than 15. I usually just do them equallly and call the result of that + simple ST "effective ST". The racial average of 25 is an overhead lift of 1000 lbs and the 35 1960 lbs. It's a smaller spread than a human 10-20.

If you leave everything else alone the results of Super Jump 2 is rather modest but you can pump that up with boosts to DX, HT and Basic Speed. Max those out (Racially but not individually) and you've got a standing horizontal leap of 68 feet. A amxrd out indviual could do such a leap of 148 ft.

At the screaming edge of TL12 (and probably using active nanites) you could have some things such as skin like bioplastic.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:32 AM   #18
whswhs
 
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Well, to be perfectly fair here, it wasn't "Faster than a Locomotive" it was "Faster than a speeding bullet! More powerful than a locomotive! Able to leap tall buildings at a single bound!"
Yes, but the original story showed something less impressive than that. Its Superman was faster than a locomotive and more powerful than a speeding bullet.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:40 AM   #19
naloth
 
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
And yet it's quite clear in that first story that Superman is not travelling alongside the train in great bounds like John Carter on Mars. He's shown as running. And dramatically, I think seeing him bounce along like a kangaroo would make him look comedic rather than heroic; the gait isn't quite suited to the human physique that he shares.
I already went back and added EM as the primary ability with Super Jumping as an AA. The exact gait seems more like a special effect, but there is some utility in not having to follow a straight line in a 1 second jump move. Dramatically it's more a matter of taste. I don't think anyone finds the Hulk bounding at you comedic, and witnessing it in real life would be rather alarming.

Quote:
I also think that, however you represent his movement, there is a strong case to be made for give him higher Basic Speed, because it seems as if Superman has superhumanly good reflexes. If you gave him Basic Speed 12, he would get Basic Move 12 for free, which would roughly double his jumping ability—and his running ability, if you go that way. And he would always be able to act faster than any normal human.
Arguably he deserves them. He just never used them in early appearances. I considered a higher basic move, but ultimately didn't put it in the racial profile. Also, we are back to a question of what all Kryptonians get vs Superman in particular.

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Originally Posted by TGLS View Post
Well, to be perfectly fair here, it wasn't "Faster than a Locomotive" it was "Faster than a speeding bullet! More powerful than a locomotive! Able to leap tall buildings at a single bound!"
That's from his 1941 slogan where he was well on his way to having every power under the sun.
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Old 08-05-2020, 12:26 PM   #20
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Default Re: [Supers] 21st DCU Golden Age (DC Nerfed)

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
Technically it's a Racial +10 ST and +5 Lift/Strike/HP and then 10 pts individually above Racial average. You could have the Lift/Strike/HP other ways as long as no aspect was more than +10 and the total of the 3 no more than 15. I usually just do them equallly and call the result of that + simple ST "effective ST". The racial average of 25 is an overhead lift of 1000 lbs and the 35 1960 lbs. It's a smaller spread than a human 10-20.

If you leave everything else alone the results of Super Jump 2 is rather modest but you can pump that up with boosts to DX, HT and Basic Speed. Max those out (Racially but not individually) and you've got a standing horizontal leap of 68 feet. A amxrd out indviual could do such a leap of 148 ft.
Eh... 4x base distance is still nothing to sneer at (although it always seemed liked a questionable value for 20cp to me). ST 35 guy, w/o assuming any Move enhancements or high Jumping skill, and using the optional ST and Jumping rule, has a base standing broad jump of 13', and a running jump up to double that. With SJ2, he can do a standing leap longer than a typical single tractor-trailer.
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Originally Posted by Anders View Post
There's a cat species called the Serval, which is about twice the size of a housecat (20 to 40 lbs.) It can jump 10 feet into the air without a running start and without really exerting itself. Amazing animal.
There was an Animal Planet show, My Cat from Hell. One episode from about 6 years ago had a guy that had two Savannah cats (mix Serval and domestic house cat) which would jump up to his kitchen cabinets and light fixtures, along with less cute features like tearing his stuff up and hissing at visitors.
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