Two charming people meet...

[arnej]

Watching another PC in a game I'm in, a Charisma-laden negotiator, and I got to wondering - "What possible defense could there be for someone like this?"

Aside from GM-inflicted TDMs, are there any mechanisms to temper someone charming?

I was toying with "Every level of RR modifier possessed by the NPC negates a similar one of the PC" sort of thing.

Is there anything like this? I don't have easy access to Social Engineering. Are there rules in there for these occasions?

[Fred Brackin]

[QUOTE=arnej;2289381]Watching another PC in a game I'm in, a Charisma-laden negotiator, and I got to wondering - "What possible defense could there be for someone like this?"

Aside from GM-inflicted TDMs, are there any mechanisms to temper someone charming?

The Indomitable Advantage from Basic negates it altogether unless the Charismatic one also has Empathy.

A mechnism I recall seeing somewhere is to go to Resistances from Basic and take Resistance to Persuasion. It was priced so that the full Immuintiy version came to 15 pts and was essentally the same as Indomitable.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

A mechnism I recall seeing somewhere is to go to Resistances from Basic and take Resistance to Persuasion. It was priced so that the full Immuintiy version came to 15 pts and was essentally the same as Indomitable.

That's in Social Engineering. You can also buy up Will as such and be highly resistant as a side effect.

[AlexanderHowl]

Empathy would still circumvent Indomitable. An interesting thing about Influence skills is that NPCs can inflict penalties on PCs equal to margin of success. For example, a successful Diplomacy roll could inflict attack penalties while a successful Sex Appeal roll could inflict Per penalties. In addition, Influence skills are usually not supernatural, so they do not usually obey the Rule of 16.

[Plane]

In the situation of 2 people who both have high charm but low will, maybe they both just become enamored with each other and become good friends?

That or, maybe once you are charmed by someone you should have penalties to manipulate them because you don't want to?

[Hide]

Regarding the OP,

I know empathy "jams" indomitable, but what about "obscure"? You could buy obscure with the extended enhancement to make empathy fail (10 levels to block it, completely).

Originally Posted by Plane

In the situation of 2 people who both have high charm but low will, maybe they both just become enamored with each other and become good friends (...)

That could happen between two NPCs after a reaction roll, but between players or NPCs and a players I think that's pretty unlikely unless players decide to play it in such manner.

Most probably, if the NPC "fails" and has a very good reaction roll towards the player, maybe the player will decide to follow a romantic interest (or something beyond "professional" matters).

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Hide

Regarding the OP,

I know empathy "jams" indomitable, but what about "obscure"? You could buy obscure with the extended enhancement to make empathy fail (10 levels to block it, completely).

s).

You could only obscure Empathy if it came with a power modifier.

[Black Leviathan]

No, but neither is there something to defend against someone being tall, or The King. Being likable or convincing isn't necessarily something that requires being countered. And where it puts you at a disadvantage in dealing with them it doesn't control anything. The only thing you'd be countering is someone sounding reasonable.

[Hide]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

You could only obscure Empathy if it came with a power modifier.

Not necessarily, “extended senses” featured under “detect” allows for believable remote sensing. If someone has an unbelievable positive level of charisma-empathy, it is plausible conceiving the existence of people capable of overcoming it.

You may also think of people born/trained to hide their emotions quite well (ultimately reflecting as an advantage, as charisma-empathy does). You can flavor obscure under this scope, and buy an “obscures motives” enhancement to bust the charismatic-empathic type character.

[arnej]

Originally Posted by arnej

I was toying with "Every level of RR modifier possessed by the NPC negates a similar one of the PC" sort of thing.

Upon further perusal, I found that Status bonuses are based on relative Status. A Status 7 King gets a +1 RR bonus when chatting with a Status 6 Duke.

I may have to do something similar with Charisma.