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Old 08-27-2017, 02:14 PM   #11
Bruno
 
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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Originally Posted by lachimba View Post
Well flight (winged) explicitly tells you that it requires wings.
But Magical, -10% is not how you get wingless flight, nor "well I have wings but they don't matter". Your player is arguing that Magical, -10% makes his ability better.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:31 PM   #12
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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But Magical, -10% is not how you get wingless flight, nor "well I have wings but they don't matter". Your player is arguing that Magical, -10% makes his ability better.
I fully understand.

I even used Superman (super -10%) and xray vision as a comparison.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:46 PM   #13
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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Originally Posted by lachimba View Post
Well flight (winged) explicitly tells you that it requires wings.
Yes it does but that's beside the point which is that magic can be and is located in specific body parts. You could probably have +50% modifier for dark vision that isn't dependent on eyes.
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Old 08-27-2017, 03:01 PM   #14
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

If the character is some kind of snakeman or lizardman I'd probably allow that Darkvision works via some sort of other vision organ. It still would see the Gorgon and be affected however but you would end up with two sets of eyes effectively as a 0 point feature.
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Old 08-27-2017, 03:02 PM   #15
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
You could probably have +50% modifier for dark vision that isn't dependent on eyes.
Less than that. You take Injury Tolerance (No Eyes), Limited (Darkvision). Though that's probably -0% unless there's some other restriction on your darkvision.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:21 PM   #16
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

Damage to the eyes bypass the skull DR. That's a very important detail in certain situations. Also even 0 point damage attacks will shock and cause intense pain.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:40 PM   #17
David Johnston2
 
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
Less than that. You take Injury Tolerance (No Eyes), Limited (Darkvision). Though that's probably -0% unless there's some other restriction on your darkvision.
Well if you want to balance the point then I guess 20%
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Old 08-27-2017, 05:09 PM   #18
whswhs
 
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

Having Injury Tolerance (No Eyes) is 5 points. If your Dark Vision works without being attached to your eyes, and if it's close to a full substitute for visible light vision, it's probably worth 5 points. If losing your eyes subjects you to the limitations of Dark Vision, maybe slightly less, say 4 points. If you just have a separate set of Dark Vision organs that can be targeted as readily as normal eyes, but you have to damage both to blind the person, I wouldn't call that more than 1 point. But anything outside that range is unreasonable for the kind of thing we're talking about.

But Magical, -10%, doesn't give you any of that. It gives you susceptibility to losing you Dark Vision in various ways, and that's all.
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Old 08-27-2017, 05:52 PM   #19
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

OP, my answers are yes, yes, yes (probably, case by case) and yes.
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:15 AM   #20
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Default Re: Darkvision (vanilla and magic -10%)

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Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
If you just have a separate set of Dark Vision organs that can be targeted as readily as normal eyes, but you have to damage both to blind the person, I wouldn't call that more than 1 point.
On a side note, that sounds like being mechanically equivalent to a Gadget Limitation where a sensor can be damaged but not stolen.
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