Opinions on rogue type skills.

[Kingmaker]

After changing the stye of an encounter based on ideas I got form this forum. I'm trying to get a good understanding of how various stealth skills interacts. Sorry I know this is a lot of questions but I want to do it right!

So camouflage is the skill to make yourself unseen, or your equipment unseen. Correct me if I'm wrong but it interacts with stealth in that it can give you either a second chance at not being spotted if you blow your roll, or give you a bonus to your stealth. (but not to being heard). Size modifiers work for equipment, but so does vision distance.

Camouflage is also used in trap setting to prevent the trap from being spotted? I'm curious how this works, is the traps skill only for setting and disarming it?

Would spotting a trap be a perception based traps skill roll? Then disarming it be an IQ based traps roll?

I understand that difficulty to spot a trap and to disarm the trap is supposed to be dependent on trap sophistication, but should the success margin of the trap layer effect these factors? Should camo come into it at all?

Does anybody think the observation skill should help to find traps? Perhaps with a default?

Surveillance equipment uses an electronic operations skill to set up the equipment, and traps to spot it? Does a person have to make a camo roll to hide their equipment? or is that included in the electronics operation roll?

Anyway, thanks to anybody who helps me out with this. Unfortunately I have no really experienced gurps players in my group. So I'm supposed to be the "rules guy" and I'm not exactly 100% on gurps as you can see.

[roguebfl]

Camouflage is sight only, and mostly designed for stationary only, but on the upside can be used on others.

Stealth is sight and sound and includes moving.

[Gold & Appel Inc]

Originally Posted by Kingmaker

Camouflage is also used in trap setting to prevent the trap from being spotted? I'm curious how this works, is the traps skill only for setting and disarming it?

Would spotting a trap be a perception based traps skill roll? Then disarming it be an IQ based traps roll?

Yep.

Originally Posted by Kingmaker

I understand that difficulty to spot a trap and to disarm the trap is supposed to be dependent on trap sophistication, but should the success margin of the trap layer effect these factors? Should camo come into it at all?

Sure. If the trap has been intentionally hidden, roll a contest between the trapper's IQ+Camo vs the spotter's Per+Traps.

Originally Posted by Kingmaker

Does anybody think the observation skill should help to find traps? Perhaps with a default?

That's not really what Observation does.

Originally Posted by Kingmaker

Surveillance equipment uses an electronic operations skill to set up the equipment, and traps to spot it? Does a person have to make a camo roll to hide their equipment? or is that included in the electronics operation roll?

I'd treat them as separate. Electronics Ops only covers your ability to make the thing take pictures, even if being hidden is part of its expected function, unless of course the device can be operated electronically in such a manner that it will then skillfully conceal itself...

[Michele]

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

That's not really what Observation does.

I agree with everything you wrote, but with regard to the above, I'd say that Observation, however, can provide indirect clues.

Suppose you are keeping the fence under Observation. There's a sentry walking around it the outside. You succeed in a roll against Observation, because you'd like to see whether the sentry comes at fixed intervals, and the GM will tell you: " the sentry is coming and going at random intervals; he moves off the path along the fence, in a number of places". One wonders why, doesn't one.

[Lord Carnifex]

Originally Posted by Michele

Suppose you are keeping the fence under Observation. There's a sentry walking around it the outside. You succeed in a roll against Observation, because you'd like to see whether the sentry comes at fixed intervals, and the GM will tell you: " the sentry is coming and going at random intervals; he moves off the path along the fence, in a number of places". One wonders why, doesn't one.

Pretty much what I was going to say. Overall, if you're just coming across a minefield, Observation won't help you find individual mines or chart your way through. But if you can sit somewhere hidden and watch enemy troops and trucks go through the minefield, you can roll Observation to work out the safe routes. Overall, you can't roll Observation unless your GM says you can because of the situation.

[Walrus]

Originally Posted by Michele

One wonders why, doesn't one.

And this is place for another roll: general IQ, Soldier, Tactics or even Intelligence Analysis. For minefield you could even roll against Cartography to plan a route.

I can't find references but I know a legend about some great chemist (usually Mendeleev) who stole secret of some industry (usually some kind of gunpowder) analyzing large-scale supplies going into and out of factory.

[Captain-Captain]

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

That's not really what Observation does.

But Observation is Perception used stealthily. If it's higher than PER there's no reason not to use it in lieu of Perception. A boosted perception score does improve your chances.

[Refplace]

Originally Posted by Captain-Captain

But Observation is Perception used stealthily. If it's higher than PER there's no reason not to use it in lieu of Perception. A boosted perception score does improve your chances.

Its boosted becasue it focuses on a specific kind of thing. Doesnt replace all PER rolls.