Things players say to me

[AlexanderHowl]

Having spent a couple years learning TKD, there is no way that kicking the head of a ready target is anything but a boneheaded move. The utility of TKD in a street fight is fast and powerful kicks to the lower body. A high kick against anyone but an amateur in a real fight is just begging for a Leg Grapple followed by any number of horrible things happening to your lower body.

[lachimba]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl

Having spent a couple years learning TKD, there is no way that kicking the head of a ready target is anything but a boneheaded move. The utility of TKD in a street fight is fast and powerful kicks to the lower body. A high kick against anyone but an amateur in a real fight is just begging for a Leg Grapple followed by any number of horrible things happening to your lower body.

I dont think Im surprised by any of this.

I think the point for me is that there are more and more players that I dont want to GM for and probably despite them turning up they really dont want me to GM for them either.

If it wasnt TKD it would be just something else.

If I have the choice between patiently explaining to them why they are wrong and having them still ignore me or doing something I actually enjoy then I'm going with the latter.

[Kax]

I used to do TKD and he's smoking something if he's talking about general combat.

According to my TKD teacher the high sweeping head kick, designed to hit the head, isn't much use for anything else. A standard sweep kick or a side kick are much better for every other target. I'll note also that he demonstrated to us (using me as the practice dummy, so I got a good look at it) that a side kick to the face is a better but less spectacular way to hit the head anyway, and told us to leave the sweep to competition bouts.

It does hit the head more easily than the torso--because you're aiming above the shoulders and standing very close to the opponent, and in a real fight you're inviting him to duck under the kick and punch you a couple of times in the groin that's been presented to him at punching height and range with no defense on it.

So the guy's right, for a very specific value of 'right'.

[evileeyore]

Originally Posted by Kax

So the guy's right, for a very specific value of 'right'.

Exactly, he's right if he really likes getting punched in the groin.

[Kax]

Originally Posted by evileeyore

Exactly, he's right if he really likes getting punched in the groin.

Or is doing a demo and the other participant isn't going to fight back.

[whswhs]

I have no skill in any martial art—I spent a year trying and wasn't ready for the first belt exam—but I have to say this sounds a bit like "the scriptwriter is on your side."

[Kax]

Originally Posted by whswhs

I have no skill in any martial art—I spent a year trying and wasn't ready for the first belt exam—but I have to say this sounds a bit like "the scriptwriter is on your side."

Ayup; 'doing a demo'=='has a scriptwriter'.

[Kax]

Lachimba:


So, go do the thing, run what you want. Even one convert is good. Visibility is better, especially if you make a point about the number and quality of resource books.

[Polydamas]

Originally Posted by lachimba

Me:

Where do you want to kick him

Player: It says here that skull is -7 to hit.
We do tai kwan do and its easier to hit the head than the body.

Me: yeah and I do Muay Thai and Im pretty sure the GURPS MA authors know martial arts. Are you really sure that you arent just practicing hitting the head over and over again in a sporting environment and that means you think that its easier but in real life people tend to raise their hands to block their head. Do you also think that maybe the head is a smaller target than the large torso and generally people trying to hit it with projectiles and weapons have at least some penalty.

Player: no the head is easier to hit.


Me: ....

yes, GURPS' random hit location table and hit location penalties are an old part of the system, before good sources were available, and they lump together projectiles, thrusts, blows, and kicks into one system for convenience. In the real world, blows with weapons tend to land on the edges of the silhouette (Skull, Face, Neck, Arms, Legs) while projectiles tend to hit things in proportion to their exposed surface area, but the default rules are SIMPLE and let you get on with the fight. There are various optional rules in eg. GURPS Martial Arts and GURPS Martial Arts: Gladiators if you want to represent how different types of attacks behave more accurately, but as always, its much easier to make something more complicated than to make it more realistic. Posture, measure, the weapon used, presence of shields or armour all affect which targets are good ones.

In addition, what counts as a hit in a point-scoring game like SCA heavy fighting or a TKD tournament is not always the same as a Hit in GURPS combat. The Defensive Attack and Telegraphic Attack options in GURPS MA can help to represent techniques like these which deliver a touch but would not inflict as much damage as a basic Attack in GURPS.

[Michael Cule]

Thinking about it, kicking in the head should be hard. High kicks are hard and leaping kicks harder.

(Well, they look harder to an unhealthy old git who has never done either in his life.)

Punching in the head though....

Your fists are about the right height, you are going to be more able to hit the upper body with your fist than you are the leg.

(Has to be said I've never punched anyone in the head either.)

But do we really want to go for different hit location modifiers for hands (and hand held weapons) and for feet?

And you can hit someone standing in front of you with a spear just about anywhere.

This could easily get more complex than most people want to deal with.